Does the new KITT 2008 has a jet sound?

[knight56]

Does the new kitt have a Jet sound like the classic sound ? you know the real kitt did not sound like a normal car..what do you think?

[Solid Snake]

No, as this is a highly efficient recycling gasoline engine with a supercharger.

[seeker78]

Well the proper way for it to sound would be like a Toyota Prius as KI3T is a hybrid. So it should be quiet unless going at high speeds or long distances, when the gasoline engine is activated to be used as a generator for the electric motor. In fact there should be scenes in the new series where KITT goes around in electric power only, for stealth.

If Ford were smart they would come out with a hybrid version of the Ford Mustang that goes at least 100 miles on pure electric before the small motorcycle engine is activated to extend the range. But the car world isn't like the computer world...in Silicon Valley if one company comes out with an innovative product, 10 other competitors are going to try to do the same thing by next quarter. In Detroit, it takes like 5 years to develop one car. That's why electric cars from Silicon Valley are going to overtake Detroit eventually..."Elephants can't dance" as they said about IBM. Tesla is based here in the bay area btw. although just north of silicon valley so not actually a silicon valley company. their current model is made in england but the next ones are going to be made in the bay area.

--Brian (grew up in silicon valley)

[PHOENIXZERO]

Have they worked out all their problems yet? I was interested in the Tesla Roadster but then I read they were having a lot of problems, specifically with the transmission.

[tamatt27]

Well the proper way for it to sound would be like a Toyota Prius as KI3T is a hybrid. So it should be quiet unless going at high speeds or long distances, when the gasoline engine is activated to be used as a generator for the electric motor. In fact there should be scenes in the new series where KITT goes around in electric power only, for stealth.

If Ford were smart they would come out with a hybrid version of the Ford Mustang that goes at least 100 miles on pure electric before the small motorcycle engine is activated to extend the range. But the car world isn't like the computer world...in Silicon Valley if one company comes out with an innovative product, 10 other competitors are going to try to do the same thing by next quarter. In Detroit, it takes like 5 years to develop one car. That's why electric cars from Silicon Valley are going to overtake Detroit eventually..."Elephants can't dance" as they said about IBM. Tesla is based here in the bay area btw. although just north of silicon valley so not actually a silicon valley company. their current model is made in england but the next ones are going to be made in the bay area.

--Brian (grew up in silicon valley)

The car you're describing with a gas generator for the electric vehicle is essentially the Chevy Volt. No other major auto manufacturer has a vehicle like that on the market. The Pruis is a hybrid, however the Volt is essentially an electric car because the gas motor does not power the car, only charges the batteries.
Your comment on 'If Ford was smart...' is amusing. Every auto manufacturer is researching hybrids that get more mileage on electric-only power. It's not a matter of Ford being smart, just that the battery technology simply isn't ready and feasible yet to support your idea.

[seeker78]

Your comment on 'If Ford was smart...' is amusing. Every auto manufacturer is researching hybrids that get more mileage on electric-only power.

Yeah well, they're all researching hydrogen fuel cells too (which I do think is the future). Silicon Valley is going to kick Detroit's butt. Detroit is going to learn that 5 years is a LONG time to develop a product. Intel comes out with a new processor every 6 months or so, sometimes a year. See the magazine "Fast Company".

It's not a matter of Ford being smart, just that the battery technology simply isn't ready and feasible yet to support your idea.

Tell that to Tesla Motors, the battery seems to work just fine in their car, 250 miles on one charge. 0-60 in four seconds (superior to a ford mustang gt500kr). That's with a Silicon Valley designed battery pack. It actually has 2,000 batteries of the kind you would put in your laptop.

The main problem I see with the Volt is that the engine they are using seems comparable to the size of a normal car engine...there's no need for that to my knowledge. There is some kind of problem with the design of the car, all you really need is a small 2 stroke engine like a lawnmower engine or small motorcycle engine. It just needs to do enough RPM to power an electric generator. With a V8 or whatever, you're just adding weight for no reason other than to excite car people. But then I admit I am a computer nerd not a car nerd. People on gm-volt.com tell me I am overestimating the size of the engine and it is smaller than I think it is. hmm.

actually...woah...funny I mentioned that...check this out:

Electric GT500KR that goes 0-60 in 3.9 sec and 200 miles range!

Yet more proof that electric power is SUPERIOR...move over Detroit get ready for the Silicon Valley computer nerds to make real cars!

--Brian

[PHOENIXZERO]

As I mentioned earlier, Tesla has had to downgrade the 0-60 time to 5.7 seconds due to problems with getting the transmission they had to work reliably without breaking due to how an electric engine works with always providing 100% maximum torque. Plus the mileage on a charge has been reduced, I think it's 220-230 miles now.

I dunno if they're still working on the transmission issue or if it's been resolved but I do remember reading that they models that were released would be "upgraded". That's another issue, Tesla has no where near the production capacity of any real automotive companies and if they actually want to make any sort of impact they can't depend on Lotus/England forever.

GM did have a plug in electric that was out in California called the EV1 but GM being the short sighted idiots they are dropped it and basically forced everyone who owned one to turn them in to be destroyed. If GM had stuck with the EV1 and continued to research the technology we'd probably have something that's full electric much more advanced than what's in the Tesla Roadster when it comes to battery technology, plus the Volt or something like it would have probably been out a lot sooner and lead to something better.

GM probably wouldn't be in the toilet either.

[Solid Snake]

For one KI3T is not a hybrid as far as I know? It is more of a Kinetic design more than anything as KI3T does not have an electro motor (complicated is not always best), KI3T recycles the motion and heat he produces giving him superior power and mileage... in theory.

About the transmission issues with cars like the Tesla, as Telsa is an all electric car it has to cope with tremendous amounts of torque, far higher than any conventional petrol or diesel engine... so essentially the torque is ripping the box apart.

Also... for the people who think hybrid cars or electic cars are the solution to the worlds CO2 problem, they are not. The amount of energy used to build one single hybrid car and thus the amounts of CO2 being released is much much higher than with that of a conventional car... Also, what if you crash the car? The higher amount of batteries means they you can not simply dispose of the car that easy as you would a normal car. I do however think that making and developing hybrid cars is a good thing to learn more and more about how to perfect our cars and make them more efficient untill the day we finally get to find our ultimate solution for the polution problem (which will not be a hybrid or electric design, but that is just my vision.). But yes we are heading off topic here, if you want to talk about this further with me... feel free to send me a PM .

[cloudkitt]

Well the proper way for it to sound would be like a Toyota Prius as KI3T is a hybrid. So it should be quiet unless going at high speeds or long distances, when the gasoline engine is activated to be used as a generator for the electric motor. In fact there should be scenes in the new series where KITT goes around in electric power only, for stealth.

If I had to guess I would say that they're always going to use the big, powerful V8 sound for the intimidation factor. It may be unreaslistic but I personally prefer that over the Prius 'RC car-sound' anyway. In the old show whenever they wanted KITT to sound menacing they would let the V8 sound appear over the 'jet' sound. But even the old KITT had 'Silent Mode' (one of the few April Gadgets that stuck around for more than an episode), so they'd only have an easier time explaining it in this one.

[seeker78]

For one KI3T is not a hybrid as far as I know? It is more of a Kinetic design more than anything as KI3T does not have an electro motor (complicated is not always best), KI3T recycles the motion and heat he produces giving him superior power and mileage... in theory.

"SOLAR POWERED HYBRID ENGINE: STANDARD" -- Knight Rider ad

A hybrid does still use gasoline...to have more range. With a hybrid, you don't care if you run out of charge on the batteries because you have the gasoline to give you the same range (well actually a little more) than a gasoline powered car would. KI3T never said he doesn't have an electric motor, he just said that he does use gasoline.

Also... for the people who think hybrid cars or electic cars are the solution to the worlds CO2 problem, they are not. The amount of energy used to build one single hybrid car and thus the amounts of CO2 being released is much much higher than with that of a conventional car...

If you look at that electric Ford Mustang GT500KR I pointed out, the body of the car is exactly the same, the only difference is that they took out the heavy, bulky, inefficient, pollution spouting internal combustion engine and put in a nice, quiet, efficient, green device. They are basically the same car except for the power plant. So you can't really say the electric version somehow has a greater "carbon footprint" than the gasoline version. The V8 might be more "manly" if you're Tim Taylor, but it is not technologically superior.

Electric Ford Mustang GT500KR runs on batteries and has better performance

Also, since an electric car is inherently more efficient than a gasoline engine, even if the power is coming from a coal power plant, electric car produces 97% less pollution than a gasoline engine powered car.

V8 engine weighs what? 800 pounds? The electric motor in the Tesla weighs...70 pounds. That also tells you how much better electric technology is than mechanical, but does it seem logical to you that a 70 pound device would require more pollution to make than an 800 pound one? Engines produce more pollution when they're running than they do being created.

This also speaks to the point I was making earlier...take a car like the Pontiac G7, and replace the engine with an electric motor and batteries, and it will have equal or superior performance to a mustang gt500kr. Pontiac does race G7s, they replace the engine with a V8 and convert the drivetrain to RWD. and people also race with G7s that use FWD.

Also, what if you crash the car? The higher amount of batteries means they you can not simply dispose of the car that easy as you would a normal car.

hmm I don't think you could say that lithium is worse to get into the soil than lead or gasoline. Gasoline is considered "hazmat"...any kind of car, you can't just throw it in the landfill, you have to process it to remove the more toxic stuff before you do that.

[seeker78]

As I mentioned earlier, Tesla has had to downgrade the 0-60 time to 5.7 seconds due to problems with getting the transmission they had to work reliably without breaking due to how an electric engine works with always providing 100% maximum torque. Plus the mileage on a charge has been reduced, I think it's 220-230 miles now.

Main web site says "0-60 mph in 3.9 seconds" and 220 miles range. I just looked 3 seconds ago. Under "performance specs" it also says "0 to 60 in under 4 seconds". They originally said 250 miles, but 230 is still excellent. Your commute is probably 20 miles one way.

And not every electric car has transmission problems, the EV1 for example did not. Wrightspeed X-1, a non-production car which uses similar technology, doesn't have those issues either, neither does Venturi Fetish...etc. Electric is still a superior technology, and in the future, all cars will use electric as the main drive, whether the electricity comes from batteries, an ultracapacitor, a hydrogen fuel cell, or a gasoline/diesel/flex fuel generator. Why put all those extra moving parts when you just want to convert electric current to movement?

Gasoline engine is a joke in terms of efficiency, we use it because oil, a very dense fuel, is easy to get and has been in abundance in the past.

Time for the gearheads in detroit to get out of the way and let the computer nerds show them how to make a real car. It's the same kind of thing, electric car has input, processor, and output, Silicon Valley is very familiar with this, and we have a lot of electrical engineers too! Time for the Fast Companies to throw out the Elephants Who Can't Dance.

I dunno if they're still working on the transmission issue or if it's been resolved but I do remember reading that they models that were released would be "upgraded".

To my knowledge they did fix that. They were saying something about having fixed that in their blog.

That's another issue, Tesla has no where near the production capacity of any real automotive companies and if they actually want to make any sort of impact they can't depend on Lotus/England forever.

Yes, their next model is going to be made here in the San Francisco Bay Area. Originally it was going to be made in Arizona, but our Governator, Arnold Schwarzenegger, negotiated to get it made here. The Roadster was always intended to be a low production car...

GM did have a plug in electric that was out in California called the EV1 but GM being the short sighted idiots they are dropped it and basically forced everyone who owned one to turn them in to be destroyed. If GM had stuck with the EV1 and continued to research the technology we'd probably have something that's full electric much more advanced than what's in the Tesla Roadster when it comes to battery technology, plus the Volt or something like it would have probably been out a lot sooner and lead to something better.

Completely agree... "elephants can't dance"

[PHOENIXZERO]

I've love to buy a Tesla Roadster though with some custom interior... If I could afford it.

One thing, I can't remember of the Roadster has it but I remember reading it somewhere, is that you could have your own sound for the vehicle programmed in so you could have a "mean engine" sound or you could do with a turbine sound like what KITT had. I think the next step is that they need to lighten the battery pack or improve it to allow greater range and maybe work on the interior. Are they still planning on making the sedan?

Sure 220 miles is more than enough for usual daily driving but you're gonna need something else if you plan on traveling a longer distance than that. I guess you could just get another car with really good gas mileage.

[Lameth1]

Meh, I will go with Honda's water car. Electric and plug in cars still cause a alot of pollution, you just dont see it in your driveway,(electric from plug ins is still buring coal somewhere to power that socket in your garage). And all the batteries in the other electrics are a big disposal problem. They only last a few years, and guess what? If they dont make a battery that will work in you older model car, you get to have big pile of plastic waste away in your driveway because most people won't be able to afford to dispose of it.

*And honda's car looks good too.

And pretty soon with the polar ice caps melt, we will have plenty of water.

[Solid Snake]

I don't agree with you Seeker, you see... I would not call a petrol engine much less efficient than an electic engine. Sure the electric engines found in trains (TGV) are incredibly powerful and efficient... but to say a Tesla or even a Prius is more efficient because it uses an electric engine is not true... I won't go into big of a detail here because it is not the place to talk about it. But, 250 miles in a car is not a lot... especially if you consider that that only counts in ideal circumstances... and if you drive continuously. A small petrol or diesel engine however will deliver a longer range... Ford's new upcoming Fiesta Econetic (currently not announced in the US yet) will do 63 miles to the gallon and is cleaner than a Toyota Prius when it comes to CO2 emissions. And that car is NOT a hybrid design... Like I said earlier I do think that in say 5-10 years electric / hybrid cars will be a truly interesting and non compromise alternative to petrol or diesel cars... but right now they are not... The Prius appart from being esthetically challenged (not all people like its design) is not totally thought through yet, infact... you said lithium batteries are not that bad, true! But the Prius does not have lithium packs, it still uses old nickel packs (which loose their power potential quickly) the new Prius won't even have the lithium packs, due to cost... and that's the main problem with electric cars, they are still not perfectly developed nor are they cheap... in theory they are great, in practise though they are not. And again even if they get perfected I think hybrids will only be station untill we arrive at our final destination (hydrogen or fully electric vehicles).

[mads64738]

Have to say that I was pretty happy with the turbo 'woosh' used in the opening sequence of the February pilot...

Just as long as they don't use a gunshot after the 'Attack KI3T' transformation!

[cloudkitt]

Hahaha, the sonic boom? lol, that always made me laugh.

And as for hybrids, they're a temporary solution at best. Nothing's better for the environment than a bunch of dead batteries...

[seeker78]

I don't agree with you Seeker, you see... I would not call a petrol engine much less efficient than an electic engine.

You wouldn't?

Tesla's AC Propulsion (http://www.acpropulsion.com) electric motor is 92% efficient according to Tesla Motors. Isn't a gasoline engine usually 40% or less?

I said it weighs 70 lbs before, I was wrong about that, according to Tesla's page it weighs 115 pounds. Still, a V8 weighs a lot more than that...doesn't a V-8 weigh like 800 pounds or more? Yet the AC Propulsion motor is able to do the same things. Sounds more efficient to me.

Wikipedia says a normal Ford Mustang GT500KR goes 0-60 in 4.1 seconds.

The electric version does the same thing in 3.9 seconds. Not a very big difference, I admit, but the electric motor clearly has better performance.

A V-8 is inherently less efficient than a electric motor because it has more moving parts.

Now you might be thinking "seeker78, why is it that we use gasoline engines if electric motors are so much more efficient?" The answer is that, until recently, fossil fuels have been in abundance, and they provide a high energy density, and the most efficient method we had of extracting energy from them is burning them in a mechanical engine. But given a source of electricity equivalent to a full gas tank in a Mustang, the electric version will go farther.

Pretty much any modern diesel fueled locomotive uses electric motors to drive the wheels; the diesels generate the electric power to run the motors. "In the early days of diesel railroad propulsion development, electric, hydraulic and mechanical power transmission systems were all employed with varying degrees of success. Of the three, electric transmission proved to be most practical, and, except for some diesel-hydraulic locomotives manufactured for lower power applications, nearly all modern Diesel-powered locomotives are diesel-electric." says wikipedia.

But, 250 miles in a car is not a lot...

Indeed, and apparently it is 220 miles now. However, this is a limitation of how much energy the batteries can store, NOT the efficiency of the motor.

According to Auto Blog Green, the Tesla has a battery capacity of 53 kWhrs. According to this energy equivalency table, that is about 1.6 gallons of gasoline, we'll round it off to 2.

So on 2 gallons of gasoline, or 7.6 L, how far does YOUR engine powered car go, Solid Snake? Probably 60 miles or so? 96 km?

On 2 gallons of gasoline, the tesla goes 220 miles. (354 km)

announced in the US yet) will do 63 miles to the gallon and is cleaner than a Toyota Prius when it comes to CO2 emissions.

That's worse than a Tesla. For a gasoline engine it is very impressive.

And again even if they get perfected I think hybrids will only be station untill we arrive at our final destination (hydrogen or fully electric vehicles).

On this we agree 100%.

--Brian

[seeker78]

Meh, I will go with Honda's water car.

Hydrogen for large vehicles and long range, derived from water with solar and nuclear, yes I agree.

Electric and plug in cars still cause a alot of pollution, you just dont see it in your driveway,(electric from plug ins is still buring coal somewhere to power that socket in your garage).

In California, most of our power comes from natural gas and nuclear, and in any case, even if you assume coal power, you're still 96% cleaner than a gasoline powered car. (see for example Tesla Motor's site).

And all the batteries in the other electrics are a big disposal problem. They only last a few years, and guess what? If they dont make a battery that will work in you older model car, you get to have big pile of plastic waste away in your driveway because most people won't be able to afford to dispose of it.

Disposing of them is cheap, they can be recycled, it is buying a new pack that is expensive. Actually they would last 5-10 years at least. I think GM said they would be leasing the batteries, you would give the batteries back and possibly lease a new pack at the end.

--Brian

[Sky_Blue_Civic]

Meh, I will go with Honda's water car. Electric and plug in cars still cause a alot of pollution, you just dont see it in your driveway,(electric from plug ins is still buring coal somewhere to power that socket in your garage). And all the batteries in the other electrics are a big disposal problem. They only last a few years, and guess what? If they dont make a battery that will work in you older model car, you get to have big pile of plastic waste away in your driveway because most people won't be able to afford to dispose of it.

*And honda's car looks good too.

True.I agree about what you said Lameth.I would buy an electric car if the city where I lived was powered by solar,or wind energy,but not every city has solar or wind energy sources.If you can,you can buy solar panels for your home and recharge your car,but where are you going to get the money to install such an expensive thing?

I'm sorry for straying off topic,but I felt that this is an interesting opinion to comment and agree on.

[Solid Snake]

Seeker, again I do not agree with you fully... I can understand some of your points... and yes its true that an electric engine for its size has a nice power ratio... but... electric engines in cars like the Tesla are limited by their distance they can travel... sure in part this is because of the batteries. But that would be the same for gasoline or diesel cars by saying they can not travel more than 600 miles on a full tank because of the limitations of the tanks gallons it can hold.

Ford, just yesterday, delivered worlds first plug in hybrid car which runs on hydrogen to Europe for testing purposes... a modified Ford Edge... to be honest... that is the future... but even that car can not clock the mileage of that of a conventional car... that Edge can travel about 350-400 miles when fully charged and fueled before it needs a new load of H2... I agree again that the conventional motor is not efficient at all... but neither is the electic one (yet)... sure on paper it is... but not in real life, not yet... almost... but not quite yet. And let us not forget that electricity costs a lot these days... much more than even a year ago! Plus, charging a car virtually every 2 days is not very practical... because if it is a plug in car, you can not do it readily at a fuel station... so you would need to do it at home... which again is nice if you stay close by, but not practical if you need to travel further. Also... there is one thing I am sure most of us will be nostalgic about in a few years time when non petrol cars take over and that's the engine sounds... electric cars and even hydrogen cars make virtually no sound or atleast a very different sound which is not very attractive at all... but I guess that could be just me.

Thankfully Ford and other companies are atleast trying to push the technology, but honestly... the only reason why it has not become a break through hit yet is the petrol companies who are very very very affraid to see their ever higher getting profits going down and eventually fade away.

But again... Pm me if you would like to keep on reflecting about this with me... as I fear the mods will not like us going offtopic.

[Matthew]

I can only speak for myself, but I'm not one to shun an intelligent debate between people who are well versed on the subject matter.

Matt

[Solid Snake]

I think I speak in the name of Seeker too when I say thanks Matthew.

[seeker78]

electric engines in cars like the Tesla are limited by their distance they can travel... sure in part this is because of the batteries.

It is entirely the batteries. Were the batteries to hold the energy equivalent of a gas tank in a typical car (assuming they had the same mass and volume as present battery packs), the electric car would go like 2000+ miles. (220 miles on 1.6 gallons, 10-15 gallons in a tank...) I imagine your car does not go this far on a full tank.

But that would be the same for gasoline or diesel cars by saying they can not travel more than 600 miles on a full tank because of the limitations of the tanks gallons it can hold.

Yes, but a car gas tank is like 13 gallons or something like that, and batteries can only hold the energy equivalent of 1.6 gallons.

Yet, the Tesla goes 220 miles on that 1.6 gallons of gasoline.

but even that car can not clock the mileage of that of a conventional car... that Edge can travel about 350-400 miles when fully charged and fueled before it needs a new load of H2...

hmm...

Yet the 2008 Ford Mustang GT500KR has a 16 gallon (60 L) gas tank and does 20 mpg highway so that would be a range of 320 miles (514 km) according to this. So basically you're saying that the Ford Mustang GT500KR, which KI3T is based on, has insufficient range and the design should be scrapped, eh? I recommend using a 2008 Pontiac G6 instead lmao

It would seem that many drivers would be satisfied with 350-400 miles range?

In any case, getting back to my original, on topic point, according to NBC's advertising, KI3T is clearly a hybrid. "solar powered hybrid engine: standard"

"my system is mostly solar powered" -- KI3T

This makes sense as hybrid is hot stuff these days.

--Brian

[PHOENIXZERO]

No, it's range ISN'T limited by just 320 miles since there are tens of thousands of places where you can refuel in just a couple minutes. Sure the Telsa Roadster has a portable recharger to plug in but you're going to be waiting over three hours for it to do so and then where the hell are you even going to find a place to do so unless you're visiting a friend or something?

On the "bright side" the cost of the amount of electricity used really isn't that much.

[Sky_Blue_Civic]

No, it's range ISN'T limited by just 320 miles since there are tens of thousands of places where you can refuel in just a couple minutes. Sure the Telsa Roadster has a portable recharger to plug in but you're going to be waiting over three hours for it to do so and then where the hell are you even going to find a place to do so unless you're visiting a friend or something?

Parking lots can have a recharge spot,and they can have an alternator that produces electricity,and gives small recharges while they drive or stop at a stoplight.