Lectric Enterprises stole 1600$ - still owes me 300$

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Lectric Enterprises stole 1600$ - still owes me 300$

Post by Giucas77 » Thu Sep 26, 2013 5:53 am

:kitt:
Hi. I'm Giulio from Italy (excuse me if my english isn't so good).
In Januar 2010 I've bought a complete KITT dash electronics from Lectric Enterprises, I've payed it 1600$!!! After 4 years . . . . he's vanished!!!
He always responded to my emails that he was working at my order . . . . but patience is over!!!
Now he no longer reponse to me

So . . . I think . . . he stole my money!!!

Any of you have the same problem?

Thanks

Giulio
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by ivirscar » Thu Sep 26, 2013 7:31 am

Your full of crap! I've responded to you and have told you I'm working on orders but if you don't want to hear that then just wait... You'll get your order when I finish it.

Brenon
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Transparent » Thu Sep 26, 2013 8:39 am

4 years? Wow that's quite a backlog!

Maybe you could publish a queue of work somewhere so you're customers could see at what stage their orders where at?

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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by ivirscar » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:03 am

Trans... I've tried that - the above issue is only a case where his LAST email wasn't answered in 5 minutes... He should refresh his mailbox :) The emails are answered in my time usually within a day or two. I won't try posting customer lists anymore since they do not usually work and only cause more confusion.
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Giucas77 » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:03 am

ivirscar wrote:Your full of crap! I've responded to you and have told you I'm working on orders but if you don't want to hear that then just wait... You'll get your order when I finish it.

Brenon



Patience is over! I've asked a refund by email. I sold my car 2 years ago and am still waiting for your refund!
Remember . . . 4 years!!!
Last year you answered me that you were finishing the "Lucchettino" order and then you would have done mine. . . another year has passed

So please give me a refund by Paypal (giucas77@alice.it) or bank trasfer . . . . but now
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Giucas77 » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:29 am

My mailbox works fine, I work with computers every day. I have kept all the emails I wrote to you and the answers you gave me.

This is one of your reply email, you do not strike me as a kind person:
Brenon: You'll get it when I finish it... I'm through with you and your kind in Italy that wants to post *?$# on the forums...
Thank you
Brenon
(26.09.2013 - 14:56)
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Giucas77 » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:37 am

Some example of Brenon's reponses:

07.11.2010
Not yet shipped. I am still working orders thru and will get to yours soon. I
have 4 before yours...
Thanks,
Brenon

18.12.2010
I will have your's ready soon. I am still working thru and almost finished with
the 2 ahead of you. They will ship in the next 2 weeks and then I will complete
your's after them.
Thanks,
Brenon

30.01.2011
I have you a set complete but I'm waiting on your overlays to be completed...
Shouldn't be too long.
Brenon

16.02.2011
Yes Sir they are here and I'm getting your set together now. I'm checking thru
everything to be sure all is ok then I will ship in a day or two.
Thanks
Brenon

21.02.2011
I am working on completing your order. It shouldn't be too much longer. I don't have any pod elecs done yet.Thanks Brenon

03.03.2011
Not yet, I will notify you when everything ships.ThanksBrenon

03.11.2011
Hey Giulio
I am working on finishing up your order and expect to be completed very soon. I appreciate your patience while I finish up.
Thanks
Brenon

04.11.2011
No I cannot tell how many days since schedules change due to fluxuations in parts
availability, my time, ect...
I am working on your build and will finish as soon as I can
Thanks!
Brenon

21.11.2011
I am working your order now and cannot refund since I have your money in parts and time. Again, I will ship as soon as I can finish them.
Brenon

21.12.2011
I am working everything thru as quickly as possible.
Brenon
From the desk of Lectric Enterprises...

18.02.2013
I have some boards I'm working on now that will be part of yours and will finish as fast as I can.
Brenon


. . . . and I'm still waiting . . .
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by ivirscar » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:46 am

You'll get it when I finish it...
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Matthew » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:59 am

Hi there Giucas77,

I understand your frustration, but posting private correspondence really isn't the way to handle things, especially since you haven't provided your own messages to ensure an accurate documentation of events.

Now, I am willing to allow some latitude on this for the time being so that you and Brenon can hash things out, but ultimately, I won't be allowing this thread to represent an unending situation. :good:

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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Giucas77 » Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:03 am

Dear Matthew, thanks for your reponse.
Even if it's private conversations his answer is always the same for 4 years. . . I can prove his emails.

We can solve the problem simply with a refund.
So please Brenon refund me and I'll be happy

Thanks a lot
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by ivirscar » Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:44 am

As I have already invested what you've paid when you ordered, I have purchased parts and components to build your order so I plan to build and ship your order and not refund.

Brenon
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Giucas77 » Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:04 pm

This is not a speech made by an honest person. You said you're doing for my order by 4 years, congratulations you're fast. Every honest trader, however, make refunds, even if you say you bought the components. You're not doing a good impression in the eyes of KITT's fans
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by ivirscar » Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:33 pm

True but when you receive several orders around the same time, it takes LONGER to build all the orders. NO REFUNDS, orders that were placed will be shipped. I'm finished with this thread - good day

Brenon
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by kitt2k » Thu Sep 26, 2013 3:03 pm

Well I am glad you are finished with the thread but man dude, you are probably a good guy, but why present yourself as such a jerk to future customers.

Has it been 4 years, yes or no??

If yes, then this guy has a legitimate beef,and he should be refunded, no questions asked because there is NO way it takes 4 years to build these things, sorry you loose on that one. Or, he was not that important of a customer that you kept pushing him to the back of the line over and over. If those are your emails, that are dated in 2010 saying his order was indeed next, again you loose the argument, as you promised multiple times in 2010 he was next, how do you justify getting to 2013 and still not delivering, you are wrong!

HOWEVER, if it has not been 4 years, and only a few months and you have an unrealistic customer, then this is a different argument, but this type of thread about you keeps popping up, so one has to wonder why.

So how about you step up, do the right thing as a reputable business would and refund this guy if it has been 4 years, if you are that backed up, business is booming and the cost of his parts can easily get pushed to the next customer in the materials for his electronics already being ready, and not needing to be ordered, and you are out NOTHING.

Also, stop coming across like these people are bothering you, you have their money and its quite a large sum to boot, and you should not forget that.

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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Knight Racer » Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:44 am

This isn't the first time he's been accused of taking people's money and not delivering:

viewtopic.php?p=205634

I don't know him personally but I do have to wonder if other kr replica owners have purchased from him please mention how long it took for their electronics to arrive,the quality of the work,were you pleased with the final product?

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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by DevonStyles » Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:30 pm

I think you owe this guy a refund. Any proof you told this guy he would be waiting 4 years for product?

I believe I talked to you once as well regarding parts. Glad I did not decide to go through with it. If you had my money this long I would have been knocking on your door by now.

If you are backlogged this long you should be able to refund his money and then sell his to the next customer.
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by kittcar4me » Sat Sep 28, 2013 7:11 pm

All I can say is WOW.I was hoping to start on building a Knight 2000 but if this guy that makes the dash stuff is anything to go by maybe I should look at another hobby. No-one can justify keeping a fully paid up customer waiting for 4 years. Reading the email trail posted it says the electronics were ready early 2011 and all that was waiting on was the overlays what ever they are. Then later on it says he is still building the order. It is obvious to me that iviscar is just stringing people along and there is so much BS that he has forgotten what he has said and now he has been caught out. His contempt to his customers is evident in the tone of the emails. Sir if you don't like dealing with the public maybe you should look at doing something else but at least supply the orders that have been paid for in good faith from years ago!!!Finally a list of who has ordered and when the order will be furfilled could eliminate a lot of frustration.

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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by KentuckyKITT » Sat Sep 28, 2013 8:37 pm

I don't participate anymore in this hobby much mostly due to work and my car is pretty much complete except for needing a new paint job, dash electronics and a few switches here and there. I ended up putting smoke tinted plexiglass panels in the openings to give my dash a finished look for car shows. Honestly, I don't ever see myself getting a set of dash electronics unless I buy a used set or bite the bullet, take a gamble, and buy a ready to go set from an Italian vendor on Ebay. I will not wait more than a year for dash electronics, it's just not going to happen. Honestly, no one should have to wait more than 12 months unless you are having a complete turn-key conversion built.

I remember people used to say order the dash electronics first when you start, then do everything else while you wait. That's good advice if it's only going to take a year to get them, but 2, 3, 4, 5??? No. Unacceptable. You could get a 2 year electronics degree and build your own set in that time frame. I've read and "heard" about a lot of dealings lately with getting dash electronics, but these two responses below bug me:

"30.01.2011
I have you a set complete but I'm waiting on your overlays to be completed...
Shouldn't be too long.
Brenon

16.02.2011
Yes Sir they are here and I'm getting your set together now. I'm checking thru
everything to be sure all is ok then I will ship in a day or two.
Thanks
Brenon"


If those two emails are true and they refer to the dash electronics, then it looks like they were "finished" and ready to ship back in 2011. Like Matthew said, we don't see the complete conversation, but if those are true copy and paste responses referring to the dash electronics, then that's a problem. I'm sorry to see these problems are still happening even after I've been out for over a year. Honestly, I thought I might be able to order electronics by now and get them within a year, but that still doesn't seem to be the case. Maybe I'll try again in 5 years.

I would suggest for future replica builders, you should really have a binding contract drawn up between you and the seller outlining the completion date, price, and a late fee paid to you for every day beyond the completion date. I think for far too long we've been too eager to just send money with nothing in writing and no "fire under the seller" to get it done in a timely fashion. Thankfully, I've always had good luck in this hobby. I've sent money to vendors and got my products when expected and if the time frame went over a little, I was informed for the most part. Not everyone has had a good experience though. I don't know any of the details of this particular transaction other than what's in this thread, but those two emails above should concern anyone (if they are true).

I'm not suggesting that the following is going on here, but if you look at numbers for example: if 40 people send a vendor $1,600.00 for dash electronics, that's $64,000.00. It's too easy for people to forget what's important when they have that kind of cash and the ones who sent it are miles away and usually only known as a screen name on a message board or an email address. Once you open that door, it's too easy to walk through it over and over again and then you are out of money and keep taking more and more orders.

Some vendors need to realize their actual capabilities and become more specialized by only taking so many orders, manufacturing so many sets per year, each year. It is quite obvious that if a person has to wait more than one year, then this is what needs to happen. This is a very specialized hobby and I think most vendors could calculate how long it takes to put something together and how many per year they can realistically handle and just stick with that. How hard is that?? You'd have far less complaints and threads like this if people knew exactly what to expect and I'm sure it would be much easier on the vendor's headaches as well. So, I'm going to agree with the original poster and say he deserves a refund. Even if he has contributed to it taking this long in some fashion, still, it's bad business either way. At some point, you just have to realize the whole business transaction is a complete failure. Refund the guy and move on to the next one.
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by ivirscar » Sat Sep 28, 2013 10:14 pm

Everyone that has ordered WILL receive their orders... I've already stated that.
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by kittcar4me » Sat Sep 28, 2013 11:04 pm

When is a reply not a reply. Answer, the one above. What you haven't said if it will be this year, 2014, 2015 or beyond hence the need for a list???Also your refund policy or lack of it needs to be revisited. I would love to buy from you but I don't have years to wait and all you are doing are forcing people to buy the substandard offerings from other people because they can provide the items much quicker.

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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by ivirscar » Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:41 am

Buying from the others is what I would suggest until I get my back orders finished. I will then offer COMPLETED SETS ONLY. Everyone will know when I have one available for sale. I'm an individual, NOT a business, an individual that builds electronics for KR replica builders and not Universal Studios . So if someone is in need of a quality set, I will offer some already complete once I get caught up ... :)
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by NZKnight » Sun Sep 29, 2013 1:16 am

I think you should be fair to your back orders and not take any new orders until you catch up. The estimated wait times should be advised up front to all potential buyers. Your products are great but waiting up to 6 years for electronics is not good business. I get your point that you're an individual however you should look at outsourcing your electronic construction to speed up the process. I'd buy from you if I knew the wait was 6 months or less.
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by OutRider » Sun Sep 29, 2013 3:36 pm

Ive tried contacting him as well as his replies usually stop after the second email. Apparently hes terribly busy, and going around him to other vendors have given me the same results. I wonder if this is how vendors are born.... :)

I have an LE scanner and wouldnt dream of having anyone elses as theirs always fails to properly bounce side to side. Luckily I didnt have to wait long at all for it. It was the last of the original run of the halogens when you could get them for much less than you can now. I find this product to have superiority as I would believe his other products would as well. I, however find it really hard to put money down on something that I couldnt hold in my hands within six months. Thats just too hard for me to do.
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by Nicholas Knight » Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:23 pm

Ivirscar, lets be honest. Obviously the guy deserves a refund. I'm not saying ur a bad person or have bad quality products. But four years.... that's like the time period length of the ENTIRE ORIGINAL SERIES. I mean imagine being in drive thru at a fast food place over 30 minutes AFTER paying at the first window. You'd be upset, truly. If u have a lot of orders but not a lot of time stop taking orders and stop accepting prepayments. Nobody would buy from you if "will receive product in 3+ years" was in ur product description.
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Re: Lectric Enterprises has stolen me 1600$

Post by 2knight » Mon Sep 30, 2013 8:58 am

It sounds like maybe you should consider outsourcing some of your work. As with many individual business ventures, it sounds like your own ability to crank out orders as an individual is bottlenecking the whole process. There comes a time when demand exceeds your ability to produce, that's when it's time to either get help or admit defeat. It sounds like you're way past that point now. Alternatively, you could just sell products you've already completed, but that doesn't resolve your current backorder problem or the negative reputation you're developing in the meantime.

I've seen your website and have been intrigued by your scanners, but I wouldn't buy anything at this point realizing I could wait years to receive it.

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