Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by LisaRosa » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:29 pm

I loved this episode! The fight was short, but I'm fine with that. I have a feeling we haven't seen the last of KARR though. Remember when that guy said that Mike and Sarah were dead? He could be the one to bring him back. I was a fan of The Sentinel series too and to see Richard Burgi (I think that's how you spell his last name) was cool. The live chat with MasterKey was really cool too. Thanks for arranging that KRO! :good:

Now if only my DVR had worked the way it was supposed to, I would have been able to rewatch it.... grrrr. Oh well, that's what iTunes is for and the full eps at nbc. :)
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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by KamenRider » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:42 pm

Overall, great episode! I'm really interested to see where show goes from here because I feel like a lot of the kinks left from the pilot have finally been worked out so now they can just go for it. I thought the remaining crew really shined, especially Billy.

My only complaint was that I thought the final fight should have been much longer and that there could have been some forshadowing of KARR's return. At the same time though I can't think of anything in the episode that could have been cut. Hell, even the wacky bit with the xbox was relevant to the main plot.

As for the whole "One man can make a difference" thing.

Obviously when Wilton Knight said that to Michael he was thinking of him being in the field. It's kind of like in original Star Trek when they said "Where no man has gone before." They weren't trying to say only men can explore space. They were talking about mankind. Wilton was talking about the power of one individual to be a force for good and effect positive change in the world. Wilton was not trying to discount the contribution and work of Devon or Bonnie and definitely not KITT.

With TNG they adjusted it to "where no one has gone before" and I think this is no different really. Graiman said "you can make a difference." He's including his own daughter as well as Michael, Billy, Zoe and of course KITT. It's ultimately the same idea. YOU can make a difference. Any one person can make a difference so imagine how awesome it can be when people work together.

Sound corny? Maybe. But no less true and no less awesome.
Last edited by KamenRider on Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:44 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by fernbern0131 » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:43 pm

Heck, I'm thrilled with the new KARR. I grew up watching Transformers, and the 2007 movie was great. I was elated that KARR was able to transform into KITT's twin. I just wish for more personal interaction between KITT and KARR.

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by lunchmeat » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:43 pm

Like most other people here, I also think that this might have done better as a two-parter. I was pretty surprised when Sarah told Mike that KARR was chasing him - I didn't think Mike would have turned around to confront KARR immediately. When he did make that decision, I thought he was going to lose and they'd have a "to be continued" thing...but hey, for what it was, I thought it was great.

The VFX were completely completely awesome. KARR looked completely, well, awesome, and he fit perfectly into every shot - nothing seemed or felt out of place. I was actually surprised at the realism of the entire thing. Great job, 3D and 2D guys. (The transformation was also a high point for me.)

The battle was short....but I'm not sure that it was the timeframe that got me. For me, it was the editing - the shots were very cool, but they came in rapid succession and it was sometimes a bit difficult to follow the action. I have a feeling that the VFX department made longer scenes and they were heavily edited for length to fit into the hour-long format. The main thing that underscored the editing, though, was KARR's dialogue - his dialogue was superimposed onto the fight scene, and it felt like it didn't quite fit. If KARR had said his lines during the KARR/KI3T chase scene, after Sarah informed Mike that KARR was on his tail, then it might have worked better, for me, at least (and then Mike would say "I'm going to end this here") but for what it was, it was great.

Ski mode rocked. I was afraid that any uses of Ski Mode would be really cheesy in this new series, but it was a perfect solution for the situation at hand and worked seamlessly with no cheese at all. I'd never considered the possibility of using Ski Mode to dodge missiles.....awesome.

Overall, considering the time that the VFX department had to put into this episode, and the constraints of the TV programming timeframe, this episode owned for me. I know I've used the word awesome a lot, but it's the only thing I can think of - it was great! I think we'll see KARR again. KARR was a government project, so his shell could easily be re-created...his programming's the thing that the government couldn't recreate, but who says that they didn't make a backup of KARR's core programming for future use? ;-)
If I am destroyed... ...so shall you be. -KARR

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by JJSoCrazy » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:47 pm

- I like how KARR had the original scanner sound and the voice was pretty good.
- I loved the fact that FLAG was mentioned and is back in the game now.
- I really like how Wilton Knight was mentioned.
- Very cool with the hologram, nice job on that guys!

- I didn't like how KARR vs KITT battle was rushed like crazy and instead of that stupid Xbox scene they could have used more time for KITT vs KARR or all the typing they did.

So many missed opportunites as everyone said:
- No reference to MK or KI2T or even the infamous "one man can make a difference" quote.
- The original KARR AI mentioned

On a final note, did anyone discuss why KITT said that he felt like he was "missing something" at the end? What could this be? Could KARR have kept something from him maybe or something with KI2T?

Joe
Last edited by JJSoCrazy on Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:56 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Shredder565 » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:52 pm

Total Let Down.

- For all that hype, we got maybe 5 minutes worth of KARR on Screen?
- No KARR theme music, even an updated version of it.
- Felt like it should have been a two parter somehow.
- Too much time focused on techno babble between Zoey and Billy.
- How about a little back story on KARR himself, other than a quick blurb on stuff we already
know, or guessed like Mike's history?

What they should of done.....

- Someone from Michael Knight JRs past finds out about KARR, resurrects him, and goes out on a
rampage. KARR destroys the SSC, kills Torres, and leaves KITT for dead. Mike has to rebuild
KITT from almost scratch, and a weakened KITT goes head to head with the full strength KARR.
Maybe with some plot line to take away KARRs transforming ability, making it a more even match
between the two vehicles..

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by fernbern0131 » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:53 pm

The new KARR was voiced by Peter Cullen who was the voice of KARR in "Trust Doesn't Rust".

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by tmtcnya » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:53 pm

I thought the plot was awesome. Great 1 hour of TV. A lot of people complaining about the time of the fight scene. If we remember back to TDR there was not even a fight scene just a chase. KARR goes over a bank and DOES explode only to come back in KITT vs Karr with a couple of laser shots and a turbo to end it. There is no comparison. The ending to this episode was way more exciting and action packed then the previous KARR endings. Thought the last four episodes of this series needs more attention from NBC. I think this could be a great series!

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by fernbern0131 » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:02 am

I really think this series could be saved by a at least a cameo of the the original KITT. Call me crazy. And William Daniels is in his 80s now, so the voice of KITT 2K would probably sound old.

Heck who knows, maybe that would add to the show. If not, they could replace the voice with another voice. But It would be great to have both KITTs on the screen at the same time.

Heck maybe Michael Knight would reunite with Kitt 2000.

Guess that's wishful thinking. Duh on me

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by My_Friend_KITT » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:06 am

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!

That was freaking Awesome!!!!

I loved it....Very Very Good!


The only drawback I had was the last scene before the Theme song....

But I am still sooo happy!!!!!!!
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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by egomez2777 » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:20 am

Just had to chime in. I'm a new member but life long knight fan, and totoally finally knows how it feels like to be a star trek or star wars geek. I was literally clapping and cheering when KARR appeared, the fight scene (which i do agree was very short) and the mention of Wilton Knight and F.L.A.G. possibly returning.


Would anyone be as interested as i am in seeing a storyline involving the son of Garth Knight and Goliath?

I think they are going in the right direction. I loved the episode! :kitt:
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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by knight56 » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:24 am

where can i watch tonight knight to king pawn episode? :roll: :roll:

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Rainack » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:27 am

scorbing wrote:Well I saw the episode and I liked KARR's new look but I was a bit dissapointed with the final battle between KITT and KARR. I expected a bit more than that. They could have done it better. We didn't see enough of KARR. I don't know but it wasn't what I expected, nevertheless the Visual Effects team did a great job.


I too felt that the fight should have been longer. I also felt there should have been more KARR in the episode.

After all of the hype and looking forward to this episode for three weeks, I thought that while good, it was a bit of a let down. I think out of all of the episodes so far, this is the one I didn't like.
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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Charlie Brown » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:38 am

I'm hoping and praying that you guys are right...that the KITT vs. KARR battle was actually a much longer fight, that got cut down due to time constraints.

Is anyone with me in asking for the director's cut of "Knight to King's Pawn" on the DVD release?

Heck, I'll take the director's cut of "A Hard Day's Knight" too!

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Mike Knight » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:46 am

Well, that was the single biggest disappointment I've ever had related to a television series, let alone this whole series. What a rushed, wasted opportunity.

I personally think the people who were overall pleased with the episode are certifiably insane. And I don't care how cruel that sounds.

I had my smaller problems with the episode, such as the pacing and the cramming-in of information that should be important to us but isn't because it's all thrown at us. The revelations in Mike's past should have been more meaningful, but was blurted out as fast as possible for time. The contemporary music was atrocious. Wouldn't the resuce of KITT have been better with the Knight Rider theme playing triumphantly?

But my biggest problem? The bait-and-switch, just as I had feared it would be. And was fooled into thinking it wasn't, for a while. KARR-in-name-only. What a waste. All signs point to the show being a continuation of TOS (even in tonight's episode!), and the BIGGEST part, the thing that could have tied KR08 and TOS together, KARR, wasn't even the same character!

It wasn't important to me that they explain how he was resurrected from the bridge site. I didn't care about that. As long as they confirmed it was the same AI, I was content to fill in the blanks with my imagination (a'la KARR surviving at the end of TDR). But the idea of a doppelganger form, the yellow scanner, the name and ESPECIALLY the re-casting of Peter Cullen, was all to go toward the biggest bait-and-switch in TV history. All signs pointed to the same AI, finally, a recurring character, a drawing-on of TOS mythology, and it turns out it was all just to hook fools like me into being interested. GST/NBC latched onto the name of a well known piece of KR history/mythology, and just used it to draw interest, without even giving a damn about what kind of expectations it stirred. How sickening.

But worse than that was how unimpressive KARR-E was in the grand scheme of things. He was just a one-off, completely unmemorable villain. Nothing special in his introduction. He was just... there. Transformed, rolled out. No fancy reveal. Nothing atmopsheric or dramatic or even intimidating. And then the fight is woefully short. Was the CGI impressive? Hell yes. The guys at MasterKey outdid themselves, but for what? I couldn't give a damn about the character in the end. There was nothing special about KARR-E or the fight, period. The coolest part was the Turbo Boost-in-regular mode (something that looks MUCH better than ugly Attack Mode TB), but it was such an easy defeat for a character that was hyped up as so "awesome and intimidating," when he was neither. And not even a bone thrown to hope for his return, not that I care to see it. Two minutes of a useless fight that I had no emotional investment in. The battle of TOS's 'KVK' was infinitely better, and NOT because it was TOS, but because it was simply handled much better, by, well, people who know better how to make television.

The disappointment of this has turned me off to the show. Not even the end tag about Wilton and restarting FLAG will keep me watching. I'm done with it, not going to even ride out the rest of the season. And it wasn't even that bad of an episode! But the fact that my expectations were used to trick me (basically) actually angers me a lot, which is a surprise even to me.

The worst part of the whole affair was that it was not KARR. Had it been confirmed to be the same AI? That would have made the sting far, far less. Had they just NOT committed the bait-and-switch and called it "KRO," without the Peter Cullen casting? I wouldn't have had a problem with the episode, at all.

The use of the name and the voice was PURELY to decieve. And that says it all about the show. GST has no idea how to handle the show right for it being a continuation (which every sign, including tonight's episode, has indicated that it is supposed to be). The pilot showed that David Andron had infinitely more intention of being faithful to the continuity of TOS in HIS continuation concept. If he had been handling the series version in the first place, the show would have been written better from the beginning, and KARR would have been the same AI, with the carry-over explained enough to properly appease the fans that expected it. This is just the icing on the *?$# cake that is GST's Knight Rider.

At this point, I don't care if we get a second season, and up until tonight, I was all for it. If you're going to use TOS concepts (like, well, a character FROM TOS), do it right or don't do it at all.
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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by BlueChaos » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:47 am

Charlie Brown wrote:Heck, I'll take the director's cut of "A Hard Day's Knight" too!

You can watch the cut parts in the Knight Research website.
I hope they can put some of the cut parts from the KITT vs KARR scene there too, if it exists in the first place. *woooosh*
"If Darth Vader had a KITT bathroom, then he would have ruled the galaxy far far away since a long long time ago..." *LASER!* :good:

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Glissard » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:12 am

I was glad to see that KI3T can turbo boost without Attack Mode. Personally. I would be happier seeing KI3T remain a Stang and still use all his functions. I always thought Attack Mode was kind of pointless. More so now. Anyone agree?

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Ontario Knight » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:22 am

I have to say that one of the things that I loved about this episode and I posted earlier last month was music in the series..

I love the new Black Ice AC/DC album, I bought it for War Machine however listening to it, I liked Rock and Roll Train better. And low and behold they play that song on this episode and I have to say that the song fit the cooriography, very well done...

As for the episode I liked it however disappointed that the entire episode wasn't about seeing KARR like in TOS. KARR was actually a character in TOS. In this episode I felt like KARR was just filler in the episode..

Personally if I was NBC and I still think this series has more potential, at near 6 million viewers I feel that GST needs to be pulled and Dave Andron or someone else Glen Larson maybe to give more creativity would be better for continuing this series...

However I am liking the fact that Billy is finally becoming a adult rather then a kid working at KR..

Sarah is developing as well, more adult...

Mike is developing becoming more like the Michael Knight we all love..

Zoe is still Zoe but with a bit more spark, with the abundence of spark she already had...

Character development is coming along now that 3 characters are gone and they aren't overlapping each other, the story isn't as confusing...

I think we all expected this episode to be more then it was but we all can't have what we want sometimes and enjoy what we do have....

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by sacerdos » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:32 am

Speaking of music, check out this Sammy Hagar classic. This little video shows in a few short minutes why the old series beat the pants off of KR 2008.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwDEqLHwNwk

Okay, Okay, I know this should be over on the constructive criticism thread, but I can't resist putting here after that episode.

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Mathyus » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:35 am

I was glad that we finaly got to know about Mike's past. Now, i will have to say that I got a little emotional my self when I was the money transfer with FLAG and all of that, as well as Dr. G's talk at the end. Wonderful

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by fatkidskinnyman » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:48 am

Am I the only one still weirded out? I am not going to cry foul or theft or anything like that. I'm writing a fanfic, so technically I am the one thefting. But, am I the only one who sees this? Can someone put this into perspective for me? Maybe something about this ep being written half a year ago or something (I have no idea when it was written), and it's all just a freaky coincidence? I'm inviting anyone out there to bring me down a notch.


This episode was filmed in Oct which means the script was probably written in mid-late September. I'm going with freaky coincidence.

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by PunkMaister » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:48 am

I loved this episode although it is obvious that quite a few scenes were omitted. One in particular shown in the NBC site itself is a green screen sequence of Torres being hurled by KARR into a wall. That was for whatever reason taken out, which is kind of sad. The duel was too brief in my opinion and KARR was dispatched way to easily and way too fast. But I like many others doubt it will be the last we will see of it.

I had my doubts about the re-boot but they have done a wonderful job, The SSC belongs to Knight industries after all so it belongs to them! I too loved how they have really put the characters of Zoe and Billy to work for what they really were supposed to be to begin with computer geniuses and not 14 year old peeping toms! :good:

Of the cool highlights worth mentioning in this episode was the worm that Sarah activated in her Dad's computer that transferred all Knight Industries accounts into her name! That was straight out of the movies Hackers and Antitrust! laugh.gif Did anyone see how much money that was? Sarah has enough money to refit the SSC not only as she and her teamates see fit but to buy a dozen or more C130s to replace the one that crashed if need be as well, so I have no doubt we will see a C130 Mobile transport for KITT again only this time with the Knight industries logo and the whole nine yards as they say.


Another highlight was when Michael was busting arse left and right just to get to KITT and save him using non lethal but effective weaponry in the process...

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Lynda414 » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:51 am

fatkidskinnyman wrote:
Am I the only one still weirded out? I am not going to cry foul or theft or anything like that. I'm writing a fanfic, so technically I am the one thefting. But, am I the only one who sees this? Can someone put this into perspective for me? Maybe something about this ep being written half a year ago or something (I have no idea when it was written), and it's all just a freaky coincidence? I'm inviting anyone out there to bring me down a notch.


This episode was filmed in Oct which means the script was probably written in mid-late September. I'm going with freaky coincidence.


Whew! OK, good. Thank you. That was going to keep me up all night.

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by Stargazer » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:53 am

NBC can shut this project down and save some money.

It is my opininon that killing Bruce Davison's character was a very dumb move - and the reboot is garbage from the starting gates. I'm more than disappointed

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Re: Live Discussion - Knight to King's Pawn

Post by GarthKnight08 » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:57 am

Whats funny to me is that it took a entire season & a total fan backlash to get the show moving in the right direction! What i mean is so i guess now they will be trying to make a show more like the original as a continuation as they should have before wasting time, money & most importantly the shows future with this first season of about only 2 so-so episodes that didnt make you crindge with disgust. As for this episode i mean is there really anybody out there who can honestly say that tonights show was done right & it was a great? Yeah, Yeah the SFX were good & all that & Peter Cullen sounded cool but there isnt anybody out there that can say that your not totally disappointed like the rest of us & those of us KR fans that know the whole timeline which is 99% of the people who watch this show know that the timeline in this alternate universe (which is what i like to call it) is totally screwed up as if the original KARR never existed & i caught some things before to suggest that the original KITT never existed either! For instance remember the episode with the forgettable guy that created the nano virus referred to Charles that KI3Ts AI was the first of its kind? That said to me that the first KITT didnt even exist because Charles would have created that advanced AI 25 years ago! They cancel out all of the original KITT & KARRs backstory but still keep Wilton Knight & FLAG in it! That doesnt make any sense or am i missing something here, for godsakes if so somebody tell me!
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