Live Discussion Thread: Knight of the Iguana

[EdwardKnoxII]

Well in a way KITT is Sarah's car. I mean it seems she gets to drive KITT as much as Mike does.

[knightofthephoenix]

She said it was her car when Zoe and her were arguing towards the end about who was going to go with Mike.

Interesting I didn't intercept it the same way. KITT has said in the two other episodes he is legal property of Knight Industries.

[knightfever]

KITT has told Michael in two different episodes that he is the property of Knight Industries, so technically he is no more Sara's than Michael's. I would think that if KITT has an "owner" it would be Charles.

[DA89SOUP]

I have been reading all the postings here for a while and tonight I decided to join and post. My take on tonights episode is pretty much how I have felt about the whole new show from the begining. Its a train wreck I cant help but watch. I think its because I grew up with the old show and loved it that I just cant let myself be disapointed. Dont get me wrong Deanna Russo is so hot I cant stand it, and Smith Cho aint bad either. I found it funny in tonights episode how they called the Land Cruiser a Beach Cruiser and how the letters on the grill of the Land Cruiser read oota. Ford is so involved in the show it almost wrecks the show for me. My other problem is how it is just so unbelievable at times. Like in tonights episode Kitt ends up in the water after the mistle hits him. Before the rocket was launched at Kitt it did not look to me like there was water anywhere around him. Also in the end fight sceen where Mike just appears out of the air to fight the badguys seemed kinda odd. The whole show just doesnt flow well and is way to driven by Ford. I am like all of you I want the show to get picked up for a whole season. I would like to keep seeing Deanna in her underwear and in a bikini, but I fear the show is just to awkward to make it.

[PHOENIXZERO]

Charles, but Sarah had a hand in it as well if that from the backdoor pilot is still intact. Either way, it's more her car than Zoe's. They should have had them fight more over it. >_> <_<

[epc1122]

maybe since sarah is the daughter of charles, kitt considers them to be the owners of him. but when she said that, i immediately interpreted it as kitt was/used to be her car. maybe it was just sloppy writing? im not sure, but it would make sense, at least to me; that it was hers originally, didnt want it anymore cause her father gave it to her and they were going through problems and he kept it and turned it into kitt. in my head, i like it lol.

[Rockatteer]

KITT has told Michael in two different episodes that he is the property of Knight Industries, so technically he is no more Sara's than Michael's. I would think that if KITT has an "owner" it would be Charles.

And that in itself is straying away from the original idea of Knight Rider too much for my liking.

Kitt should have one driver and pre-programmed to protect that driver at all costs as in TOS. Whats kitt gonna do if he has a couple of people both in trouble at the same time? Morph into 2 vehicles?

As much as I like the show and want it to succeed, I really think the producers need to get their act together and start following some of the basic Knight Rider formula.

[dcpan]

Believe it or not, so far, I actually enjoyed this episode the most.

This episode is actually the most cohesive episode so far, where they weren't "trying to hard" to be cool.

I actually find myself enjoying Smith Cho's character more than Deanna Russo.

About the only two things that kept me from enjoying the episode are:

1. The special effects are the cheapest looking thus far of the three.

2. The end twist was too fast...I totally missed the why they are blowing up the powerplant part, not to mention, the smart missle ended up doing so little damage I doubt it could have penetrated the concrete at the power plant...Michael should have been DEAD.

YMMV

[dcpan]

I'd like to clarify what I mean by I didn't like the special effects in case any NBC folks are reading as I would prefer this to be constructive rather than a rant.

1. The car just "disappears" before it hits KITT. Seriously, even a cheap CGI car flying into water would have been better than the disappearing act.

2. That computer graphic of KITT in water...you might as well just blue room it interior only, then have them drive out onto land.

3. Driving onto land...it was clear that the car never came out of the water...just drove up a sloped beach. Even the old Bond movie or old Knight Rider show had more water actually on a car...if you are going to do a "water mode", get the car in some water "please".

I'm not trying to be mean, but really, the special effects of this episode has been the weakest thus far.

[Sue]

This episode had some good funny moments. I still don't know how I feel about Zoe though. Probably because I'm more interested in the kind of relationship drama that we saw in the back door pilot. Zoe and Mike's relationship is more of an adolescent type of relationship.
I found it hilarious the three of them trying to squeeze into attack KITT, I guess that answers our question about no back seat.

[JTurchetta]

I think some of you are missing the point of this series.

it is not going to unlock the secrets of the universe, nor is it going to show you the path to enlightenment. IT WILL, however entertain you for an hour. Help you forget that the real world is falling down around us. That being said, and approaching the show in that manner, it is very entertaining.

A few quick responses. Sarah showed up with Billy to install the program be cause she was JEALOUS of Mike being with Zoe. OF COURSE she could have uploaded the program from the Kitt Cave, but there are obvious feelings and underlying sexual tension between her and Mike. Even her attempt to sway the decision away from Zoe going onthe mission was a hint to that.

Having watched the original series, as it first aired and not through re-runs, I have to say i do very much enjoy the show. Sure it doesnt have the tightest of plots, but you can sense something is building with Mikes story, with the Knight Industries tech being stolen, KITT, the whole works.

Its a good show, and over time it will be better. I am a fan, and will watch it every week, first run, or re-run.

J.

[cloudkitt]

overall, i kind of found the episode boring. especially compared to last weeks. however, i did like that they said how kitt is technically sarah's car. instead of mike longs trans am being converted to kitt, we have sarah's car being turned into the new kitt.

For the record, even the old KITT was property of the Foundation. Arguments over whether KITT was ACTUALLY Michael Long's Trans Am notwithstanding, KITT still didn't belong to Michael. In Knight In Disgrace, he does have to steal KITT remember.

And dcpan, they said the specialty of those missiles was destruction of the target with no collateral damage, so Mike living probably makes sense.

[BlueChaos]

This episode had some good funny moments. I still don't know how I feel about Zoe though. Probably because I'm more interested in the kind of relationship drama that we saw in the back door pilot. Zoe and Mike's relationship is more of an adolescent type of relationship.
I found it hilarious the three of them trying to squeeze into attack KITT, I guess that answers our question about no back seat.

Agreed.

The funeral scene and the conversation between Mike and Sarah was genuinely moving, to say the least. These three episodes were nowhere near that, they did not have any strong emotional moments like in the pilot.

[vertigo778]

Regarding the VFX:

"1. The car just "disappears" before it hits KITT. Seriously, even a cheap CGI car flying into water would have been better than the disappearing act."

Creatively the idea was to keep the audience guessing what happened to KITT. Was KITT blown to pieces? If we showed the car actually flying off the cliff you wouldn't have the same suspense (though we would have loved to show it Frame by Frame through it and you'll see the car being blown to the side though!

I'll post an early previz sometime soon on this site.

"2. That computer graphic of KITT in water...you might as well just blue room it interior only, then have them drive out onto land."

We would have liked to do more to be honest, but time constraints prevented building out too much of the ocean floor. If we ever have a whole underwater action scene I guarantee you'll see more underwater coolness (and fish

"3. Driving onto land...it was clear that the car never came out of the water...just drove up a sloped beach. Even the old Bond movie or old Knight Rider show had more water actually on a car...if you are going to do a "water mode", get the car in some water "please"."

The car is too valuable to actually drive it into salt water. In the old bond movies they had the budget to destroy cars, we don't, particularly that tricked out Mustang. I would have loved to do more CG water rolling off the car, but again time constraints and the budget constraints of episodic TV made it impossible for this show, and we had to sell it with editorial cuts. Hopefully we'll have more water stuff in further episodes we can play with.

[Joe Huth]

I'll be honest, there was something lacking in this episode for me. It wasn't awful, but it just didn't feel like "Knight Rider" to me, like last week's episode did. Both my wife and my mother have commented on the abundance of women in bikinis in these first three episodes and I agree - that needs toned down just a bit. There were some cool moments and it's great to keep seeing new KITT features. This is the "Deadly Maneuvers" of the new KR. Next week's episode, however, looks amazing and I can't wait to see it!

Joe

[Knight Racer]

When Zoe and sarah were fighting over who gets to be the passenger when Michael and Kitt are ordered to leave the base in attack mode towards the end of the episode.

[Garthe Knight]

I liked the episode. This show grows on me, I am enjoying it more and more every week.
Wonder how long it will take 'til I can accept the attack mode.

Oh, and give the guys at vfx a rest, Knight of the Iguana didn't have any real flaws. Even the HUD improves, I like that it only uses red and blue (KITT's colors) and does not show too much info at one (like it did in the first episode). Feels more cleaned up and fits the purpose. You did a good job here.

[bson]

I just love this show. Everything is so neat and cool. There are so many pretty people. It's like watching your favorite soap. The effects are so awesomely real. The best show ever. NOT!!!!!!! If your in Junior High or High School, you probably love it. If you actually grew up watching the original show or at least watched the reruns, then you know the new show is a glitzy, watered down version of the original. This weeks episode is even worse than the last. I'm glad to see more people finally telling the truth about their complaints of this show. If you watched this episode with the sound off, you might have thought you were watching the wrong channel and that this must have been an episode of Baywatch: The Next Generation. The effects are still lacking and not really believable. Yes, James Bond did the car submarine around thirty years ago. The missle hit was pretty lame. You want us to believe the car gets hit by a missle, vanishes into thin air, goes over a cliff a hundred feet away, drops into the water and everybody is fine. Kitt might be indestructable, but people would most likely go squish in this situation. As some people have already discussed, I want one driver. I would prefer there to be fewer or no passengers. I'm tired of every episode looking like a teenage social mix with Kitt as the party favor. There was a reply by a person who is supposedly a creative writer or consultant. Those things said are all poor excuses. If you don't have the money or time to do something right, don't put it into the show when you know it is going to look lame. Devote your time and money to better scripts and actors. Yes, I know that I will now be labeled a hater. I wasn't at first. I had valid criticisms about the show and its direction, because I wanted the show to succeed. I just have a bad feeling that people are going to start giving up on this show, fans and new viewers alike. Though I could be wrong. Baywatch did have a fairly long run.

[vertigo778]

hehe, for the record Baywatch is the highest rated show in the world by a longshot

[Hardkore]

Well for the most part I really enjoyed it last night.


Hmm,nobody has said it yet? I will,in the words of Zoe,"Last night was epic."

[DevonStyles]

I thought the episode was horrible. This show is going to be cancelled when it's this bad. For starters I am starting to like the surrounding story lines better then what's going on with Kitt.

My main complaint.
Kitt got hit by a freakin missle, and I am assuming went airborn and crashed into the water and sunk. The acting is horrible. They looked like they were out for a sunday drive. Surely they can do better then this. The actors need to get a little more emotionally involved.

[neps]

I thought last night was a good episode - but it was my least favorite thus far.

I think we are all gravitating towards the first two as favorites because of the fact that those two episodes were more action focus, and this one wasn't. Short of the Rockets, the episode as a whole was more character/plot driven then the last two combine - that's a good thing though, you need that balance. I'm on the 'I don't like Zoe' bandwagon, however she grew on me last night. All we had heard before last night was those silly one liners, but last night we were able to look at her character a bit deeper, and it helped. It also helped too that the people at KR seem to be in the same boat (no pun intended) as us - that she's waaaay to quirky.

Another moment I liked was KITT being shot over with a missile. I wish they showed more of him falling off the cliff after the break, it seemed too clean, I would have liked to see Mike being jostled and KITT having to check his systems. But being blown off a mountain top like that was a fun idea.

In general as a series, we need a Mike and KITT episode alone. That was the core of Knight Rider, this should be the core of this one as well. The time last night where Mike and KITT were together in the car at night, I really enjoyed that. We need to see them on missions together, without a sidekick. Right now alot of time is being dedicated to growing the relationships, but there are just too many - and the fact Carrie hasn't been in the last two episodes is a sign of this - it feels like they don't know what to do with everyone. We haven't had a lot of 1-on-1 interaction. Also, this is the 2nd time tonight when KITT left Michael when he could have used him the most. In the original, KITT never ran, he would run to Michael when he needed help ("KITT, I need ya buddy!")

For the VFX guys - I loved the HUD tonight, looks like you found your groove with that. The VM looked like it had a slight boost again, as the eye wasn't as overpowering as it had been cause the Voice lines were more apparent. I thought too that the green screen did seem better, cept for the part where Michael spun around the corner.

Can you guys add bullet spark effects to KITT when he is getting shot at? You're telling me 4 guys with machine guns are firing at KITT and we don't see any visible confirmation of hits? I think it would help sell the realism of KITT being protected in that respect.

What can we do to see KITT drive himself for a little bit, with no one inside? Would LOVE that.

Also, anyone notice that when the doors of KITT open, there is like a decompressed air sound? It helps sell that KITTs cabin is a capsule - it's a nice touch.

Finally, I got a little hung up about the backseat issue in Attack KITT - you're telling me he can't change the lab back to seats if he needed to? Say in the scene where they were driving to the beach with all them in the car (another fun scene) and something happened where they needed to transform into Attack mode - do they have to leave the two passengers on the side of the road? It doesn't make sense...

[Garthe Knight]

The whole Attack Mode doesn't make sense. But we've been there...
KITT in his normal mode should have all the functions he needs, so I have to admit in this episode it was the first time that Attack Mode didn't feel forced "just because you can do it...". It was like super pursuit mode, KITT transformed to be faster.
But aside from that, I don't see why we would need an attack mode (or truck mode for the matter of fact).

The episode was my favourite so far, because it was a clear story, more character interaction, less smartmouth comments and some cool footage of hero KITT.

[JJSoCrazy]

I thought last night was a good episode - but it was my least favorite thus far.

I think we are all gravitating towards the first two as favorites because of the fact that those two episodes were more action focus, and this one wasn't. Short of the Rockets, the episode as a whole was more character/plot driven then the last two combine - that's a good thing though, you need that balance. I'm on the 'I don't like Zoe' bandwagon, however she grew on me last night. All we had heard before last night was those silly one liners, but last night we were able to look at her character a bit deeper, and it helped. It also helped too that the people at KR seem to be in the same boat (no pun intended) as us - that she's waaaay to quirky.

Another moment I liked was KITT being shot over with a missile. I wish they showed more of him falling off the cliff after the break, it seemed too clean, I would have liked to see Mike being jostled and KITT having to check his systems. But being blown off a mountain top like that was a fun idea.

In general as a series, we need a Mike and KITT episode alone. That was the core of Knight Rider, this should be the core of this one as well. The time last night where Mike and KITT were together in the car at night, I really enjoyed that. We need to see them on missions together, without a sidekick. Right now alot of time is being dedicated to growing the relationships, but there are just too many - and the fact Carrie hasn't been in the last two episodes is a sign of this - it feels like they don't know what to do with everyone. We haven't had a lot of 1-on-1 interaction. Also, this is the 2nd time tonight when KITT left Michael when he could have used him the most. In the original, KITT never ran, he would run to Michael when he needed help ("KITT, I need ya buddy!")

For the VFX guys - I loved the HUD tonight, looks like you found your groove with that. The VM looked like it had a slight boost again, as the eye wasn't as overpowering as it had been cause the Voice lines were more apparent. I thought too that the green screen did seem better, cept for the part where Michael spun around the corner.

Can you guys add bullet spark effects to KITT when he is getting shot at? You're telling me 4 guys with machine guns are firing at KITT and we don't see any visible confirmation of hits? I think it would help sell the realism of KITT being protected in that respect.

What can we do to see KITT drive himself for a little bit, with no one inside? Would LOVE that.

Also, anyone notice that when the doors of KITT open, there is like a decompressed air sound? It helps sell that KITTs cabin is a capsule - it's a nice touch.

Finally, I got a little hung up about the backseat issue in Attack KITT - you're telling me he can't change the lab back to seats if he needed to? Say in the scene where they were driving to the beach with all them in the car (another fun scene) and something happened where they needed to transform into Attack mode - do they have to leave the two passengers on the side of the road? It doesn't make sense...

Very good things you pointed out Neil! I was for sure on the same bandwagon of not liking Zoey but she did grow on my last night because I got to see her actual character instead of joking around. It had to deal with the characters and brought them out. I liked how KITT came out of the water, brilliant shot and they way it looked seemed very real! We definitely need to see KITT by himself a little more saving Michael, and the fact that he is the new driver as stated in the pilot, he should have most of the time with KITT!

I wish when they said Bonnie & Devon they would have explained a little more on those names, maybe a reference? Anyway I am sure that they are saving all the original series stuff for later when prepping to hopefully have DH & KI2T back! Also when I asked GST that question on NBC.com referencing MK, Bonnie, Devon, & KI2T whereabouts, he said "keep watching..." So I am sure we will see something soon!

BTW the fact of Sarah stating it's "her car" is irrelevant because I am sure she stated that because the fact she fixes KITT. Also it isn't anyones car, not even Charles even though he is the "inventor", if any it should be Wilton Knight's because he was the person who started FLAG and everything that we have today with KR, KI3T, SSC, etc. Without Wilton's dream of one man making a difference and hunting down operatives who operate above the law, we would not have anything.

Joe

[goldbug]

I enjoyed this episode because for the first time, no one felt like they were overacting and the main characters all worked together very smoothly. This is the first episode where I'm seeing chemistry between everyone from Torres to Billy to Zoe. As much as we can expect from escapist fun like KR, this ep really did have some great character moments. Mike's look as Sarah and Billy showed up at the door is priceless, and his frustration towards the end when he discovers yet another ex-soldier recognizes him made me sad for him.

I do agree that the KITT getting "blown over the side" thing could have been done smoother, but I actually get why the shot was done that way. It's all about creative license. I can think of a couple different ways the scene could have been shot, but they all add to the show's run time and would have cost more in VFX budget.

I'm in agreement with neps about the bullet spark thing. Or even another nano shot (can the basic wireframes from the 2 hr movie be reused?). Some indication of KITT either abosrbing hits or deflecting hits would be helpful as we had last week with the windshield shots.

I really did enjoy the sub-car thing. It did remind me of James Bond (in fact, most of that sequence did). While I understand everyone's preference to showing KITT rolling out of water, I'm not sure that would be feasible on the budget they have. Perhaps if the show gets picked up for more eps they can afford to work up a "mock up" with an older car that just has a Mustang "shell" around it that they can beat up.