Did I just see a possible KARR?

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Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Sky_Blue_Civic » Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:36 pm

I was checking out this video on YouTube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPwpURvSBZI and just found this in the video:Image
I don't know if it's because of the image quality(I didn't compress the image),or do we really have KARR on our hands?I have my doubts that it's really KARR.But if you pause around 1:04-1:06 you'll see the image.
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Lameth1 » Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:39 pm

I chuke that one up to image quality, check NBC.com/knight rider for a higher quality vid if you can access that.

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Niggle Snoosh » Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:06 pm

Lameth1 wrote:I chuke that one up to image quality, check NBC.com/knight rider for a higher quality vid if you can access that.


Sadly i'd say that Lameth1 is most probably right, i'm pretty sure for what i've read on the forums lately and been watching on the Comic-Con footage is that KARR or at least an Evil KI3T is on the cards but he will not appear in the first 8 episodes but should by episode 13.

I could be wrong but i don't think they have finished filming that many episodes yet and i also get the feeling that the teaser is probably from the first episode only or 3 episodes together at the most
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by FuzzieDice » Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:40 pm

Sometimes reds can be distorted to amber or yellow in some video compression schemed. KITT's scanner's true color is in fact red. No intentional hint of a KARR there. :)

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by watchall » Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:49 pm

I don't think it's KARR. it's just the way it was edited. The same scene is at the end of the trailer with a red scanner.

Image

Image

Image
Last edited by watchall on Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Sky_Blue_Civic » Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:51 pm

I give my thanks to everyone who pointed this out to me! :D
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Will » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:35 pm

[spoiler=]Well you do know that it was said that KITT will become more dangerious ass the series progresses. Taking orders from higher ranking officials and then later doing whatever he wanted. So perhaps your right...Perhaps KITT will eventually become KARR...and that will give Gary a reason to bring in Hoff and Original KITT in a two hour piece.[/spoiler]
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Sue » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:57 pm

Hello, I am Sue’s Hybrid Automated Droid One-thousand. But you may call me SHADO.

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Lost Knight » Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:22 am

No, I don't think it's K.A.R.R., which is not to say that he or another evil car won't appear because that's apparently in the works, but in this instance I think it's just the picture resolution.

However, I think the concept of K.I.T.T. going bad or disobeying orders himself is far more interesting of a concept, à la "Killer K.I.T.T." If they go this route, it would certainly force Val Kilmer's character to show more personality.

The "evil twin" or equal adversary (i.g. K.I.T.T. & K.A.R.R.; Data & Lore; Spider-Man & Venom; MacGyver & Murdoc; The Flash & Polix, etc.) concept feels very '80s to me, which may be the goal to re-create, or may feel too dated.
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by pheonix_knight » Tue Jul 29, 2008 10:31 am

GST did make reference specifically to KARR when asked would we see an 'evil twin' sort of storyline...

im guessing it wont be the Knight Automated Roving Robot much as KITT is no longer the k2000

anyone want to suggest what that acronym could now stand for???

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Lost Knight » Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:01 pm

pheonix_knight wrote:GST did make reference specifically to KARR when asked would we see an 'evil twin' sort of storyline...

im guessing it wont be the Knight Automated Roving Robot much as KITT is no longer the k2000

anyone want to suggest what that acronym could now stand for???


If it's not going to be K.A.R.R., I say skip the acronyms altogether and call it something else entirely. There's only so many variations you can make of acronyms before they start sounding goofy.
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Joe Huth » Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:09 pm

Having KARR return would be less cheesy than having a story where FLAG screwed up ANOTHER car (KARR, KRO...how many cars can they program incorrectly before learning?). "KVK" is set up for a perfect sequel. Picture this...an episode begins with a flashback to 1984 when KITT and KARR collided mid-air. Cut in a new scene that shows a mysterious hand picking up KARRs CPU from the ground and taking off. Then flash forward to today...KARR's CPU could be put in a new body. It's the perfect set up and I think, done right, it could be an amazing episode and would FINALLY answer the 24 year question of what happened to KARR.

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by PHOENIXZERO » Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:16 pm

Basically yeah, though as I've said whenever the KARR issue has come up, I'd prefer there not be a new KARR or maybe even KARR returning period. But if they go that route I'd want KARR to be noticeably inferior to the new KITT with KARR actually realizing it. I've mentioned how I'd like to have seen this sort of thing play out in another topic or two, well maybe three with one that I made months and months ago that would be a part of a decently long arc including the long lost bastard children of Garthe. But it might be too "deep" or stuck the past for the new show....

If it were up to me, it'd sort of go like this.

viewtopic.php?f=1041&t=10841
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by pheonix_knight » Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:22 pm

Joe Huth wrote:Having KARR return would be less cheesy than having a story where FLAG screwed up ANOTHER car (KARR, KRO...how many cars can they program incorrectly before learning?). "KVK" is set up for a perfect sequel. Picture this...an episode begins with a flashback to 1984 when KITT and KARR collided mid-air. Cut in a new scene that shows a mysterious hand picking up KARRs CPU from the ground and taking off. Then flash forward to today...KARR's CPU could be put in a new body. It's the perfect set up and I think, done right, it could be an amazing episode and would FINALLY answer the 24 year question of what happened to KARR.

Joe


KARR should end up in the hands of Garthe Knight, which could be the reprisal role for DH seeing as Michael Knight and MK Jnr on screen could just get too complicated...

but we have problems with that, KARR was KITTs twin with MBS and i have a feeling the makers of the new show won't (or possibly CAN'T) use that in their storylines, someone can correct or confirm this..

if true it means that the original 'baddies' such as KARR and goliath would not be able to feature in the new series in their original incarnations. What is possible, i think, is to tie in with the Feb 2hr show and have the specs for the nano tech also on the hard drives that were stolen from CG's home and have the modern technology on the old favourites.... But of course Ki3t back then only 'morphed' and thats the tech which would have been on the HDs, whereas now the car 'transforms'

Remember Mike said the blackriver guys were mercenaries so whatever they took they would sell to the highest bidder not just pass it to 'their client' if someone offered a better deal...

what would be fantastic would be a 'turbo boosting' Goliath which could do all kinds of CGI damage....

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by PHOENIXZERO » Tue Jul 29, 2008 3:38 pm

IIRC they got back all the things stolen.

If it were up to me, Garthe would need to just stay away, it was even a bit corny back then though it did make for a good story. Today it would just be beyond silly. Hell, I'd rather have Adrianne Margeaux be the survivor and had Garthe's baby, grown up and not played by Justin Bruening, than bring Garthe back. If they're still going to have the buyer thing I'd rather that be 80+ year old Elizabeth Knight than Garthe as well. I know when I was little I wanted that Garthe/KARR vs Michael/KITT showdown but it just wouldn't work today outside of fan fiction.

Heh, I just remembered an old South Park episode that had characters from a mirror dimension or something like that and all the characters from it had goatees....
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Niggle Snoosh » Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:19 pm

Joe Huth wrote:Having KARR return would be less cheesy than having a story where FLAG screwed up ANOTHER car (KARR, KRO...how many cars can they program incorrectly before learning?). "KVK" is set up for a perfect sequel. Picture this...an episode begins with a flashback to 1984 when KITT and KARR collided mid-air. Cut in a new scene that shows a mysterious hand picking up KARRs CPU from the ground and taking off. Then flash forward to today...KARR's CPU could be put in a new body. It's the perfect set up and I think, done right, it could be an amazing episode and would FINALLY answer the 24 year question of what happened to KARR.

Joe


You could argue that the poor programming angle has been done more than once before. However only one really exists in the current canon; K.A.R.R designed by independantly by Knight Industries due to a core programming issue for self preservation. KITT on the other hand was programmed for protection of others.
With Yancey Arias's character we can assume the military have an interest in what KI3T can do, we've been told his motives are still unknown, we don't know where his loyaties lie. The military (especially in TV) have always been known to have their own agressive agenda and always want the deadliest/most useful weapons available to them. KI3T is essentially a solution to their wildest dreams.

1)he is almost indestructible
2)he can transform/morph to suit his purpose
3) he has an AI that is forever learning and needs no one to operate him

To control such a device, or better still..... a fleet of such devices. Why put human lives in danger when the damage can be done by an unstoppable car........ oh but wait why stop at cars, why not implent this technology into tanks, planes, helicopters, ships, submarines.
All they need now is to control this wonderful creation, hmmmmmmm KI3T has a conscience, thats gonna get in the way. We could reprogramme him on the sly or we could muscle in and take over the whole operation but would it happen without serious repercussions. Surely it would make more sense to try and build our own, one not programmed to protect, we're not stupid enough to repeat their mistakes, we will be making something that can be controlled, if we run into problems we can just deactivate and destroy it.

Greed, the desire for power and arrogence will always make people stupid, it's human nature



KARR's cpu could have been saved, he would therefor resurface in some shape or form, with improvements but not to the extent of KI3T, i quite like the idea of him being considered obsolete and knowing it. However why should that make him less dangerous, he AI is cold, ruthless and logical.

A) He Knows how to manipulate a situations , he could lead KI3T to question his loyalties to Mike, to the foundation and to himself. Perhaps KARR could procure information that the government have plans for KI3T is be adapted to their needs, robbing of his sentience.

B) (Perhaps a little outthere and treading dangerously upon dangerous ground, new mythology wise)
KARR although appearing obsolete he has an unforseen advantage, he may not have been destroyed as we were led to believe but was still damaged to an extent he could never work again as he once did. He is no longer fully integrated into the cars systems or at one with the car as he once was and is instead an more like floating software. He now has the ability to can be jump to other systems and invade and override them like a virus. Perhaps he could even temporarily overpower KI3T's AI. Surely KI3Ts AI is more more sophisticated but perhaps those who rebuilt him in his current state are those who got their hands on some of those files stolen in the pilot, or have their own agents/moles within the military and/or government and know the backdoors to KI3T's subroutines that would allow KARR achieve his goal.

Finally i believe that Garth should be kept to the obituaries, The only Hoff role we need is Michael Knight.
Offspring of Garth however are a different matter entirely and welcomed as an adversary to Mike. One(s) that looks nothing like him as they will have no relation whatsoever
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Will » Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:30 pm

I also believe that Garth should stay dead and perhaps a relative of sorts can pop up. I mean come on if Michael can have a son so can Garth.
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by pheonix_knight » Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:53 pm

KARR was KI2T's prototype so in essence would be more than 25 years old....

i cant see a program from nearly 3 decades ago being able to penetrate firewalls and modern day AI code, so i cant see KARR being in the Mustang body that is currently driven by Mike Traceur (until 24th sep...)

one possibility is that Ki3t becomes a little too self preservative but KResearch decide to wipe and reprogram him so Ki3t (in the interests of self preservation) copies his current personality to another source before the AI unit in the car is reprogrammed. The alternative source eventually finds its way into GPS based systems and begins controlling other vehicles so whilst the mustang Ki3t can transform, the disembodied AI unit can 'transfer' vehicles by way of their GPS, uploading it self via satelite links and because it gets into the electrics of the cars it can control the 'drive by wire' steering systems, the AirCon (which can be used in conjunction with electrically locking doors for suffocation purposes if cars current drivers are non compliant)

Meanwhile the Mustang has the newer more altruistic personality (as Bonnie described KITT)

so we have a new foe for Ki3t and MK to fight but its more of a virus than a vehicle....

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by pheonix_knight » Tue Jul 29, 2008 10:02 pm

just occurred to me, in the Feb movie we saw Ki3t unlock an electronic security door and set off sprinkler systems... does this mean the new AI has the ability to manipulate all electronic devices?

if so we could go down the route of the disembodied Ki3t (well essentially it IS the 3000 AI unit) being able to disengage the nano tech protection that the car has... whole host of possibilities in there especially as the disembodied AI wouldnt be reliant on a body...

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by FuzzieDice » Wed Jul 30, 2008 5:55 pm

In the pilot they did have a moment where KI3T had to shut down or be invaded by some kind of virus that would completely control him. Then it was stopped. But what if they thought they fixed it but didn't fully and it happens again - without KI3T knowing what happened until after it's too late. KI3T downloaded to another computer and the invading AI would be - KARR!

A different twist, and rather interesting when you think of it. :)

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by PHOENIXZERO » Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:45 pm

The AI alone shouldn't be able to do that, needs the wireless abilities provided by the hardware in the car.

Excellent post Niggle Snoosh and yeah, KARR should remain dangerous even in a state of being obsolete. I was going to disagree about being able to make the new KITT question his loyalties and everything but after thinking about it a bit more I think it could work since the new KITT shouldn't know about KARR and it seems like something FLAG and Knight Industries would have kind of swept under the rug. I could see KARR telling his story (while leaving out certain details) in how he was cast aside, thrown away as he was nearly murdered before he escaped and how they went after him. All while KARR makes it sound like he's the victim. Which isn't too far off... While KARR is sentient like the original KITT, I do think even with how old he is, he could still break into newer systems.. Broken down, it's still just a bunch of ones and zeroes. KARR as a virus might be interesting but I think I'd rather have a physical KARR and either way how would KARR get online and what kind of idiot would do it? O_o

I dunno if putting KARR into a computer as software would be right, besides he'd be very incompatible with modern machines. KARR, like KITT is more than just software, something I think Bonnie mentioned in Junk Yard Dog.

I see the military angle too but I really REALLY hope they don't get political with it or try to make some statement. At the very least I don't think we have to worry about Garthe showing up. Though after over 22 years of aging, they could probably get passed Hasselhoff playing him and just get an actor that could fit his appearance, hell Garthe could have always had plastic surgery done just so he wouldn't have to have his face anymore. Problem there is that I can't see him getting over his Michael Knight obsession to stay hidden all this time. Yeah, I still much rather would have him stay dead and have had offspring.

All in all though, unfortunately our ideas won't amount to anything, the writers and the people behind the show's direction won't see it and if they did they couldn't use it out of litigation concerns, even if in every post we stated it could be used without permission, essentially saying they had permission. Maybe if they PMed or called us and offered a job as a creative consultant or assistant or credited in a "story by" manner which is done all the time in Hollywood.
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Niggle Snoosh » Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:07 pm

PHOENIXZERO wrote:Excellent post Niggle Snoosh

awww thanks :oops:

PHOENIXZERO wrote:Excellent post Niggle Snoosh and yeah, KARR should remain dangerous even in a state of being obsolete. I was going to disagree about being able to make the new KITT question his loyalties and everything but after thinking about it a bit more I think it could work since the new KITT shouldn't know about KARR and it seems like something FLAG and Knight Industries would have kind of swept under the rug. I could see KARR telling his story (while leaving out certain details) in how he was cast aside, thrown away as he was nearly murdered before he escaped and how they went after him. All while KARR makes it sound like he's the victim. Which isn't too far off...


KARR wouldn't necessarily have to get KI3T to trust him. Just place the seeds of doubt. Using his current state of obseletion to add weight to his story along with KI3T's possibly lack of knowledge of KITT and KARR.

The files about them could be classified to him specifically, although he should have the abilty to hack in seconds we find that he has an in built directive that forbids him for doing so with files that have a particular digital signature. Thus making it easy to assume he may indeed be an expendable puppet of the government.
Further fuel to the fire comes from the fact that no-one will answer his questions about KITT or his wherabouts. Rather suspicious when KITT is surely a huge success story and deserves to be honoured or be of importance somewhere

This could be a multi episode story arc that ends with KITT coming out of hiding for a possible showdown with his successor that ultimately assures KI3T of his worth and importance to those around him. It is possible that KITT (in his current state) may also be obselete in comparison to KI3T but is still willing to sacrifice himself and it is that act convinces him both of them are more than just machines and have a true purpose.

perhaps not at this juncture but it will be left open to find out what happened to KITT since FLAG disbanded, revelations of which are sure to be epic :)

PHOENIXZERO wrote:All in all though, unfortunately our ideas won't amount to anything, the writers and the people behind the show's direction won't see it and if they did they couldn't use it out of litigation concerns, even if in every post we stated it could be used without permission, essentially saying they had permission. Maybe if they PMed or called us and offered a job as a creative consultant or assistant or credited in a "story by" manner which is done all the time in Hollywood.

If NBC are watching/reading i would be pretty happy with that and if you want to throw in a behind the scenes tour of the show or something i wouldn't say no. :D

Well i can dream :P
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by Knight316 » Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:57 pm

I actually like that Idea. or maybe have KARR want to take over the body of KI3T so he places that doubt in there and makes him think that he's the victim and that the same thing will happen to him. Which leads KARR to convince him to join him in helping the greater good (and could convince him that he doesn't want to harm anyone eitehr thus not overriding KITTs program of preservation of human life) and maybe has somebody that knows the technology (a defectee from FLAG?) that will help him, thuys bringing in Michael and KITT to the rescue and have Father and Son go off to save the car and KI3T and restore him to his body somehow. Could be a great story, i only hope that they can get Opt...i mean Peter Cullen to voice him again.

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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by scottab21 » Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:02 am

Regardless all the possible angles to take this, the fact is we WILL be getting a taste of KARR or as GST put it, "a dark knight rider". I'm thinking season finale/ 2 parter old school style! 8) 8) 8)
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Re: Did I just see a possible KARR?

Post by bige12 » Tue Sep 09, 2008 7:00 pm

The New KITT scanner probally changes colors that is my guess - I think that would be cool if the scanner changes colors

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