My afterthoughts.

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My afterthoughts.

Post by killem2 » Sat Mar 22, 2008 4:13 pm

Being an extremely avid fan of knight rider I for one was excited about the return of the show. After reading these forums pretty throughly i think a lot of people really have forgotten a lot about the original show and its contents in reflection to the new one. I wanted to try and clear some things up and rant a little myself :mrgreen:

Well, the 1st thing is to address the car. Yes we know a mustang isn't a trans am. It is a severely dead horse with lots of bat imprints. I don't disagree but we really need to think about this. There isn't a new trans am in production and I honestly believe that the writers did not want this show to be another 1982 Knight Rider. The whole concept of Knight Industries and the F.L.G, was that this was a CAR of the future. Focusing more so on the technology and the brains nt the exoskeleton. Could they have used say a Camaro, or maybe a vette? Sure but a vette doesn't have a back seat, and a camaro technically isn't in production either and I am pretty sure the budget for Transformers was more than this movie :wink: . A lot of people on these forums also pull the line:

"One big ford commercial"

Pretty hateful imo. Check out oh the 1st season of episodes. Count how many other slightly older Pontiac's and gms you see running about. I assure you, you are going to be surprised. In closing of this section of my thread, embrace the new show. Its only a car. Its not a personal attack at trans am or the original K.I.T.T. Ask yourself could have have used the 1982-85 TA. Sure, but it'd look really stupid in modern day. Could they have made a new version of a TA themselves? OF COURSE! But you would see a nice pinch in the pocket to pay for stunt cars or cgi to replace it. Over all embrace the car. Who knows maybe one day Pontiac will release a new TA and kitt will face another goliath and have to be rebuilt
:twisted: :kitt:

[================================================================================]


The abilities of the K.I.T.T (3K). I think a lot of people around here jumped the gun. In the very first episode they didn't do a lot of fancy stuff besides talking and bullet reflecting. There was some turbo boost as well, You all have to understand there is a lot of work that had to be put in this. Its not just a new movie its a resurrections so they have more than just money to make they have fans to appease too. I can understand also why turbo boost isn't used in the new K.I.T.T it really was used... A LOT... I mean A LOT. I personally loved watching K.I.T.T bashed through walls. :)

[================================================================================]

Sexual References.. I also read a lot of people upset about the whole lesbian thing and young mike being just disgusting with the two woman. His dad was the same way. There was an episode in the 1st season that he hit on two women, K.I.T.T even told him before he went inside you may want extra flowers. His father was also such a woman's man that K.I.T.T began making jokes about it. So please stop with this nonsense because you sound like mindless hypocrites.

[================================================================================]

Voice of K.I.T.T.. This I heard was because the original man who did the voice (his name escapes me, so we'll call him Mr. Feeney) was still under contract with GM and thus not allowed to be the voice. Besides why would you want him too? This is a new Machine, new car, new driver, why use the same voice? Its not his voice that made him K.I.T.T it was his attitude :)

[================================================================================]

My final thought.. I feel the movie did the old show justice. K.I.T.T had great humor, and the voice is a little less whiny than the original which I didn't like much about the old show. He had lots of features and knew a lot more in the start than old K.I.T.T as you recall every other episode bonnie was always programming KI2K with something. Also its not like they didn't do a lot of things to make sure the fans are aware of they seem to remember the old show, like showing parts to KI2K in the garage, an engine, the car itself. Its not like they just decide lets make this new show and forget where it came from. Also the semi scene where we overtook it. The theme song even has the similar riffs. Also the 1st seasons two episodes didn't have anyone talking about Michael knight being a lone crusader... etc.. Also the funeral of his mom and this Dad coming back to tell him the story of Wilton Knight... he passed the torch on, and we as fans should respect that. I feel. In closing, I think a lot of people are picking at the seams, anything that could possibly counteract something about the old show, and personally I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy it. I hope you all do the same. Thanks for listening :)

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by PHOENIXZERO » Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:01 pm

While I agree with you mostly I do have to say that, maybe it's just me but while I know the original show wasn't exactly advertisement free, they didn't bash it over my head (just speaking for myself) that the car was a Ford Shelby Cobra Mustang with leaving the emblems clearly visible and even focusing on them while showing the car "transforming".... Into another Mustang, along with another spot or two when they purposely focused on them. Or the mountain chase scene with KITT swerving/driving around a bunch of a conveniently brand new looking Ford automobiles. On the bright side, at least the MOMO logo on the steering wheel went away. I can live with it as long as they don't do all that blatant stuff in the series, I have no problem with people calling the car a Mustang or whatever, just like the original KITT was referred to a Trans-Am in the first season before Pontiac decided they were apparently getting too much attention, as long as it's not done a dozen times per hour. The TA might have had some left over Pontiac markings but for the most part they weren't blatant and unless you were really paying attention, you might not even see them. Admittedly I didn't pay all that much attention to what everyone else was driving because I didn't care but in the KR08 movie it was hard not to notice. Of course there was a Chevy and a couple other non-Fords in there but we saw at least what the purpose of one of them ended up being. :lol:

Actually, I have to take that back, the MOMO emblem was still there at least in places, just not that noticeable.

Also, you messed up on the Voice of K.I.T.T issue, William Daniels wasn't the one who was under contract, that was Will Arnett. But I do agree when it comes to people *****ing about this KITT not having the same voice.

There's story issues too but I can let some of them slide a little bit due to the strike and the lack of KITT doing anything all that cool (aside from the scene at the end) to budget restrictions, after going back and watching the original pilot again it made me feel like the new one was missing something, I guess you could say, some of the magic or charm of the original but again, a part of that may just be because the car didn't have the "wow factor" that the 2000 had or the seemingly unstoppable nature of the original KITT, at least until the end with the towing gag.

I certainly wasn't one who was complaining about the "perverted garbage" as some put it or the "swearing", those one post wonders were annoying as hell, thankfully they seemed to have gone back under their bridges. They have the potential to make a good series out of it as long as they have the right writers, the corporate interference is at a minimum and they don't try to **** with the time line or turn it into another Bionic Woman. I wouldn't be opposed to their making it accessible to all ages (I became a Knight Rider fan when I was only two or three) as the original ended up being for the most part thanks to the car. If they end up pulling a Bionic Woman I'll have their heads.
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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by Dalton » Sat Mar 22, 2008 7:26 pm

Nice post OP. I agree with your thoughts.

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by DorianX » Sat Mar 22, 2008 7:55 pm

I agree that the reasons you point out are not good reasons to be upset about the pilot, but there are other far more severe problems with the pilot.

Firstly, you're correct to point out that complaining purely over the choice of Ford is unfair, but I'll assert that the product placement angle *did* go too far. Making sure we occasionally see the relevant logos is reasonable -- even only fair considering Ford's contribution. But there are places where it really grates. Sarah and KITT's little monologue about why gasoline is such a great power source feels like it should have ended with KITT saying "This message brought to you by Exxon." Frankly, the idea that a scientist of Graiman's calibre *wouldn't* have tried his hardest to power KITT entirely by renewable resources is hard to swallow (Had he tried and failed, that would have been one thing, but KITT and Sarah make it clear that it was a *deliberate decision*)

I certainly agree that there's nothing wrong with not having KITT display every ability under the sun in the pilot, but I think you overlook that the whole *point* of a backdoor pilot is to sell the idea of the series. If there's ever a time to "wow" the audience, it's now. In the original series pilot, KITT's major abilities are:
* He can talk
* He can drive himself
* He's bulletproof
* Turbo Boost

In the new pilot, KITT's major abilities are
* He can talk
* He can drive himself
* Magic Nanoskin (ie. Color Change and Bullet-proofiness)
* Integrated GPS and sattelite tracking
* Extremely high gas mileage

Of these, the first two *aren't anything new* thanks to the old series (and given that the Ford Focus commercials that *aired with the show* demonstrated that stock Fords can talk -- and some element of voice has been in luxury cars for 20 years now-- a talking car just doesn't have the "wow" factor it did in 1982), and the last two, well, they make me say "gee, that's convenient", not "wow! That's COOL!"

Personally, I had no problem with the sexual references per se, but I think that they were part of the more serious problem of the whole plot being clumsy. I have no problem with Carrie's sexual orientation, but it had absolutely no bearing on the rest of the story, which made it feel like it was just a cheap, exploitative way to titilate the viewers, a sort of "Hey! SEX! Pay attention!" Likewise, the only reason we see Mike in bed with two women is because threesomes are hot. Had they tried to do something with the sex, I woulnd't have objected -- like, if it turned out that the girl Carrie had picked up the previous night was secretly working for Blackriver, that would have dovetailed nicely and helped to reinforce the idea that Carrie isn't a good judge of character (Notice that she does not do ONE SINGLE THING in the pilot that doesn't end up hurting our heroes?) Or if we'd gotten enough focus on how Mike was living prior to the pilot, in order to really establsh that he was living a life of directionless hedonism.

On the voice of KITT: There's a difference between objecting that it's different and objecting that it's bad. In the last scene, I think, is the only time that we really see Val Kilmer's talent coming though. He's so deadpan for the rest of it that at times, he almost sounds sociopathic. His delivery was more suited to an evil computer like HAL from 2001 (In fact, I kinda suspect that Kilmer was intentionally trying to sound like HAL) than a character we were supposed to sympathize with.

My final thought is that different is fine, but different doesn't imply *good*. I agree that the feel was pretty good, that this was a solid homage to the spirit of the original. But frankly, I think the plot was just sloppy. It was if they tried to be "all flash and no substance", but they didn't even make the "flash" all that flashy.

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by killem2 » Sun Mar 23, 2008 10:23 pm

Yeah, from the way conan made it sound on his show when he had his little skit of his desk turning into KITT, he said the ratings were amazing and everyone was watching it. So I have a feeling its going places.


Also after rewatching now the 2nd season, I am beginning to see more and more things I forgot about. Turbo boost is used in many ways. Gotta love netflix :) ONLINE PLAY!

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by killem2 » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:55 pm

I don't mean to bump this, but there is not edit button O_o.

I was gonna say in the words of the great Knight industries 3000:

"Your fears are irrational and misplaced!"

:D

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by PHOENIXZERO » Tue Mar 25, 2008 3:23 pm

Yeah, you only have a 15 (I think it's 15) minute time limit on editing post.

I think Turbo Boost might have been used a little too much in the original series.
The new and again improved evil's advertisement is currently too long and too badass to display here. But let's just say that with now 50% more evil, this **** is great! :twisted: :skar:

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by pheonix_knight » Tue Mar 25, 2008 3:46 pm

i have to say as a fan of the original (and what a fan i was aged 3-7 when it aired originally) they need to decide who the demographic for this new show should be because based on that 08 pilot, it 'falls between two stools'...

even being 'liberal' theres no way i would allow a child of less than 11-12 years old to see that kind of morality (the 3 in a bed thing, the alternative sexualities which incidentally as a 29 y/o I have no problem with whatsoever)

but then the age group that the morality is acceptable to should want more sophisticated plotlines with less holes (agreed the original series wasnt shakespeare but it was as graphic either)

from a marketing point of view i think they need to remember the merchandising side of things ie toys etc, which we all had at one point or another

KR TOS had toys, comic strips, annuals, watches (werent they kewl??) and was successful enough to have us talking about it 26 years on, if they try for the older generation all they can market is ford products, bluetooth and maybe contraception....

incidentally, ive mentioned in other posts but it would be nice if Ki3t could be other vehicles too (even other fords if needs be...) as it would be more of a variation and have more scope on missions...

it can work as a ford, i dont think it will work without keeping the younger age group happy though...

and definitely need a turbo boost and ski mode in there, even if (as an absolute last resort) its a CGI job...

i want this series to work, i cant wait to see the results!

i am a fan and welcome any feedback on my comments

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by Sue » Mon Apr 14, 2008 11:11 pm

Two girls in bed was a little much, I was more concerned by the premiere held at the playboy mansion, I hope everyone took a bath after, maybe got a few shots. I’m glad it will be on at 8:00 so kids can watch, and I do hope they keep it clean because they will be watching. I don’t think Michael ever was seen in bed with anyone in the original am I wrong. The original hardly ever even had guns. I think we can do with a little more sex and guns than the original, but it should still have kids in mind.
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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by knightnx » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:13 pm

Hi Guys

Interesting stuff as always, you all make valid points.
My thoughts on the KITT 3000 / ford advertising .....

the Knight 2000 built in the 80s, was built by the Knight Foundation (in the 80s was a thriving organisation non profit i might add.. hence the license plate ) the car was purpose built, completely custom and fully tested
it had no major emblems (except on the wheels) and all pontiac badges were removed

whereas

the Knight 3000 wasnt completely finished or fully tested, it was almost like the car was born as a sideline to the prometheus project he was working on, possibly it was his hobby ( he built it at home?)
who knows if the car was finished 100% he may of changed the colouring removed the racing stripes and the mustang insignia.(its graymen's car maybe he likes the style he built it lol?)
its called kitt as its a direct descendant of the original, yes theres no devon or knight foundation anymore but he needed a cool name for the car, that being said maybe we will see the new kitt turbo boost if hes ever fully finished


its as if graymen decided to "well i have a kitt why not start the foundation?"
who knows
lets see what happens

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Re: My afterthoughts.

Post by weeezl » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:02 pm

killem2 wrote:Being an extremely avid fan of knight rider I for one was excited about the return of the show. After reading these forums pretty throughly i think a lot of people really have forgotten a lot about the original show and its contents in reflection to the new one. I wanted to try and clear some things up and rant a little myself :mrgreen:

Well, the 1st thing is to address the car. Yes we know a mustang isn't a trans am. It is a severely dead horse with lots of bat imprints. I don't disagree but we really need to think about this. There isn't a new trans am in production and I honestly believe that the writers did not want this show to be another 1982 Knight Rider. The whole concept of Knight Industries and the F.L.G, was that this was a CAR of the future. Focusing more so on the technology and the brains nt the exoskeleton. Could they have used say a Camaro, or maybe a vette? Sure but a vette doesn't have a back seat, and a camaro technically isn't in production either and I am pretty sure the budget for Transformers was more than this movie :wink: . A lot of people on these forums also pull the line:

"One big ford commercial"

Pretty hateful imo. Check out oh the 1st season of episodes. Count how many other slightly older Pontiac's and gms you see running about. I assure you, you are going to be surprised. In closing of this section of my thread, embrace the new show. Its only a car. Its not a personal attack at trans am or the original K.I.T.T. Ask yourself could have have used the 1982-85 TA. Sure, but it'd look really stupid in modern day. Could they have made a new version of a TA themselves? OF COURSE! But you would see a nice pinch in the pocket to pay for stunt cars or cgi to replace it. Over all embrace the car. Who knows maybe one day Pontiac will release a new TA and kitt will face another goliath and have to be rebuilt
:twisted: :kitt:

[================================================================================]


The abilities of the K.I.T.T (3K). I think a lot of people around here jumped the gun. In the very first episode they didn't do a lot of fancy stuff besides talking and bullet reflecting. There was some turbo boost as well, You all have to understand there is a lot of work that had to be put in this. Its not just a new movie its a resurrections so they have more than just money to make they have fans to appease too. I can understand also why turbo boost isn't used in the new K.I.T.T it really was used... A LOT... I mean A LOT. I personally loved watching K.I.T.T bashed through walls. :)

[================================================================================]

Sexual References.. I also read a lot of people upset about the whole lesbian thing and young mike being just disgusting with the two woman. His dad was the same way. There was an episode in the 1st season that he hit on two women, K.I.T.T even told him before he went inside you may want extra flowers. His father was also such a woman's man that K.I.T.T began making jokes about it. So please stop with this nonsense because you sound like mindless hypocrites.

[================================================================================]

Voice of K.I.T.T.. This I heard was because the original man who did the voice (his name escapes me, so we'll call him Mr. Feeney) was still under contract with GM and thus not allowed to be the voice. Besides why would you want him too? This is a new Machine, new car, new driver, why use the same voice? Its not his voice that made him K.I.T.T it was his attitude :)

[================================================================================]

My final thought.. I feel the movie did the old show justice. K.I.T.T had great humor, and the voice is a little less whiny than the original which I didn't like much about the old show. He had lots of features and knew a lot more in the start than old K.I.T.T as you recall every other episode bonnie was always programming KI2K with something. Also its not like they didn't do a lot of things to make sure the fans are aware of they seem to remember the old show, like showing parts to KI2K in the garage, an engine, the car itself. Its not like they just decide lets make this new show and forget where it came from. Also the semi scene where we overtook it. The theme song even has the similar riffs. Also the 1st seasons two episodes didn't have anyone talking about Michael knight being a lone crusader... etc.. Also the funeral of his mom and this Dad coming back to tell him the story of Wilton Knight... he passed the torch on, and we as fans should respect that. I feel. In closing, I think a lot of people are picking at the seams, anything that could possibly counteract something about the old show, and personally I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy it. I hope you all do the same. Thanks for listening :)


Thank You.

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